Editing Talk:Xehanort

==Untitled==
I really don't think that his spirit went on to Terra and then Terra then lost his memory and ended up in Radiant Garden, where all he could remember was his possessor's name. It makes no sense that he has a Nobody and a Heartless yet he still appears in Kh2 final mix, i would belive that his apprentice would most likely be him [[User:Saxor|Saxor]] 06:35, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

== This is just a crazy probably not true theory. ==

Maybe Master Xehanort is Xehanort's Unbirth. Think about it, the main antagonist in KH 1 and 2 were the leader and the same thing as the enemy force: Ansem=Heartless, Xemnas=Nobody.
So it only makes sense that Master Xehanort=Unbirth. But it's just a theory.--[[User:Vatek|Vatek]] 12:54, 10 February 2009 (UTC)

{{AbOhWn|text=That's exactly what I was thinking!}}

I think this is a really confusing theory
. An unbirth can only be created AFTER the death of a nobody and a heartless, because of this, MX can't be an unbirth, because xehanort is only defeated After KH 1 and 2.
Then again, MX can be an unbirth.
he spoke somewhat of how darkness wasn't the right path for him and how he didn't wan't ven to make his " mistake"
It's possible MX was consummed by darkness, and became a heartless and a nobody, these in turn could have been defeated, (Birth by sleep sequels anyone?)creating MX, who kept his personality as a heartless, nobody, and now an unbirth.--[[Special:Contributions/142.46.164.89|142.46.164.89]] 22:55, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

== Name ==

Perhaps an irrelevant detail, but I'm wondering, is "Master" part of his name, or is it just his title/rank? [[User:Drake Clawfang|Drake Clawfang]] 18:43, 10 February 2009 (UTC)

It's a title but keep it there to avoid confusion with the other [[Xehanort]]

== Xehanort ==

{{Cecil|text=I don't think this guy 's the same Xehanorth that spawned Ansem the Wise and Xemnas, why would he be older here, ten years before, than in KH and KHII?}}

are we really sure how old he is?(He might shave his head and just likes a goatee)

{{TNE|text=Even the facial features are different, dear. I'm sure our present-day Xehanort wouldn't have had a nip and tuck before actually being found by Ansem the Wise... ^_^}}

{{Kingdomheartsfreek|text=
you are wrong visit my home page, that is were i have said every thing.--[[User:Kingdomheartsfreek|KHF "fight to win"]] 23:00, 10 June 2009 (UTC)}}

{{TNE|blahtext=We didn't even say anything far apart from the theory. That's where '''YOU''' are wrong. All we did were guesses and requests for information, not statements.}}

Here is my theory: After Master Xehanort took over Terra's body Terra grew older, his hair longer, and remember that it turned gray when MX took over his body. So the present-day Xehanort is the past Xehanort in Terra's body. --[[User:ZexionFan321|ZexionFan321]] 21:52, May 18, 2010 (UTC)

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==Nomura screwed it again?==
Hold on, the guy says those who wield the darkness can't use the Keyblade yet:

Xehanort, Terra and Riku clearly use them despite this....so....what's goin' on? D: [[User:Kaihedgie|Kaihedgie]] 00:34, 7 May 2009 (UTC)

{{TNE|blahtext=Was the wielding of darkness '''real''', or was it a ploy by Maleficent ?

Also, it doesn't matter what side of the scale you're on. MX might've just gotten his facts wrong. In actual fact, those with strong hearts can wield Keyblades, no matter what their alignment may be.}}

Exactly what I was thinkin'. In addition, you can't really call the 'Dark Keyblade' a false Keyblade, or the ones wielded by Terra, Aqua and Ven for that matter. Just because they don't have a Keychain, doesn't mean anything. The Dark Keyblade, despite lackin' such a device, still functions like any other Keyblade would: unlocking hearts and gateways to other worlds. [[User:Kaihedgie|Kaihedgie]] 02:10, 7 May 2009 (UTC)

{{TNE|text=Truly, MX isn't the only one to have gotten his facts wrong : Xehanort himself did, towards the end of KH. Who knows if Nomura deliberately put it in ? We know how antagonists distort the view on things.}}

MX doesn't say they aren't ''Capable'' of wielding the keyblade just that they aren't "Qualified" to. In other words, he's prejudiced. "we don't hate it it's just kinda...Scary.But the world's made of light '''and''' Darkness,you can't have one without the other;Cause Darkness is half of Everything. sorta makes ya wonder why we are scared of the dark.
"It's because of who's lurking inside it."
Just as Dark is not Evil, so can Light is not Good.

{{TNE|text=We don't know what the true translation is : "capable" or "qualified". But either way, MX is just one of those people who got his facts wrong. When you get your facts wrong, you have prejudices. Ansem the Wise had prejudices against Nobodies because he never wanted to accept the truth about Roxas and Namine, and he kept on screwing it up. I'm pretty sure Xehanort would've had prejudices of his own kind.

If MX ever lives through to another sequel, he should see Riku.}}

the phrases "Knight Templar" or "Well-intentioned Extremist" come to mind

"Light and Darkness are mear elements, only good or evil when weilded by those with good or evil hearts." True, no? In my opinion, it appears that the only "qualification" you need is a sufficiently strong heart, so long as your heart remains strong, your keyblade will stay with you, even, in some cases, a keyblade will form from your own sword if your heart's strong enough, like Riku's soul eater/way to dawn, and, even if your heart isn't in your body, the keyblade will still let you use it I.E. Roxas, Xion, heck, I bet Namine could also have weilded a keyblade, given that Kiari can. NobodiewithaHeart



In response to the comment immediately above, Roxas could only wield a Keyblade because he SPOILERS contained the remains of Ventus' heart/END SPOILERS. Xion is a copy of Roxas, and can therefore wield his Keyblade. And to clarify, there are three varieties of the Keyblade: WARNING SPOILERS

1. The whole and the two halves of the Ki-blade. <u>This/these are the Keyblade(s) used by Sora (Kingdom Key -The 'kingdom' being...well, that should be obvious), King Mickey's Keyblade chronologically after BIrth by sleep (Kingdom Key D.), And the combined 'Ki-blade' wielded by Vanitas in the conclusion of Ven's Scenario (and technically, Aqua's as well) in Birth By Sleep.</u>

2. The Keyblade of people's hearts, which can unlock Kingdom Hearts, as can the Ki-blade. <u>This is the dark Keyblade made from the princesses' hearts.</u>

3. The Keyblade of a person's heart, which will manifest itself from their own heart if the person has sufficient strength of heart. <u>These are the Keyblades used by everyone save Sora, Mickey after BBS (his original Keyblade is the Star Seeker), and Vanitas when he battles Ven in their awakening (he otherwise uses a finned keyblade with two eyes on the blade and hilt). </u>-Xabrin

==Master Xehanort's "Mistake"==
In the TGS2008 trailer for Birth By Sleep MX says "Use your power to defeat the darkness. And correct my mistake!". Does anyone have any idea what his "mistake" was?

probably his apprentice falling into darkness.

{{Joekeybladeaura|text=or maybe master x made the aprentice out of the darkness in his heart}}

Joe Keyblade, your theory was scary close to being correct.

== Random Shoe Resemblance ==

did anyone notice that MX has the exact same shoes/boots as the organization members, probably where the organization actually got the from.

== Similarities  ==

I found this picture that shows the similarities between Master Xehanort and Xehanort's heartless: [[File:Xehanortmasteryu6.jpg]]



Are they the same person or something?
 [[User:Ninabean822]]

{{Flashpenny | There are quite a few differences with that and more notable ones at that. 1. Xehanort's Heartless has hair and isn't bald. 2. He's not blind (milky-white eyes mean someone is blind). 3. He doesn't have any facial hair, let alone a goatee. 4. He has the tan that we all dream of instead of being paler than pale.}}

{{EO|time=22:10, 18 August 2009 (UTC)|happytext=Well, the current belief is that the Xehanort we know may be Terra. Terra may be the apprentice, as MX's A and MX become separated for a time (Terra's playable storylline). If Terra becomes Xehanort and is the apprentice, he may have acquired his master's old clothes.}}

==Speculation==

{{yer mom|time=20:53, October 16, 2009 (UTC)|text=I don't know what you guys think but the speculation section in this article is a bit... crazy >.>  Besides, didn't we have a policy for no speculation in articles and a '''Speculation''' header defies that completely? I propose the speculation part is moved to a forum thread so people can go wild with their thoughts there while the article remains with only the known facts. }}
{{EO|time=20:55, October 16, 2009 (UTC)|text=I'd side with that. Wow guys, just wow. We've let the speculation thing stay this long >_>}}
{{yer mom|time=20:56, October 16, 2009 (UTC)|text=Yeah I'm just moving it, since it's ridculous}}
{{User:Xiggie/TalkTemplate2
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|sig="Your body submits, your heart succumbs— so why does your mind resist?" 
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==New Screenshot==

A recent scan[http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/6356/bbvjump101709p1.jpg] has a full body in-game screenshot of master xehanort maybe that would be a better picture for this article.

I have provided a better picture but Yer Mom is reverting it. --[[User:Guyviroth|<span style="color:black"><b>Black Summers</b></span>]] 21:26, October 20, 2009 (UTC)

{{GS|time=21:30, October 20, 2009 (UTC)|text=It isn't a better picture, it's terrible quality.}}

... right, so you'd prefer a side-face shot over a full body shot? --[[User:Guyviroth|<span style="color:black"><b>Black Summers</b></span>]] 21:31, October 20, 2009 (UTC)
{{GS|time=21:32, October 20, 2009 (UTC)|text=Until an actual good quality scan comes out, yes.}}

That's quite humorous. --[[User:Guyviroth|<span style="color:black"><b>Black Summers</b></span>]] 21:33, October 20, 2009 (UTC)

:Don't rever the edit please. The image you uploaded is a bad quality one. We'll stick to the artwork until a better scan comes around. --{{User:Yer mom/Sig}} 21:38, October 20, 2009 (UTC)

Right, next time i'll try and find one with dynamic lighting and in HD. --[[User:Guyviroth|<span style="color:black"><b>Black Summers</b></span>]] 21:38, October 20, 2009 (UTC)

Well at least the new one is alright.--[[User:Masgrande|Masgrande]] 07:12, October 23, 2009 (UTC)

== MX's Clothes ==

{{Maggosh|text=Has anyone else noticed that MX wears the same gloves and boots worn by Braig, Dilan and Aeleus?}}
{{LapisScarab|time=18:57, January 3, 2010 (UTC)|text=Master Xehanort, Xehanort's Heartless, Braig, Dilan, and Aeleus all wear the same boots and gloves, yeah. It looks like Even and Xehanort also wear the same boots as the others, which in turn look a lot like those worn by Orgnaization XIII members.}}
{{TNE|time=02:24, January 4, 2010 (UTC)|text=That was something I actually realised when the renders of the OXIII members were out.}}

== Speculation ==

{{Xemwath|text=I think Master Xehanort is trying to break in Ansem the Wise's lab to do experiments with the darkness in people's heart.  Since Terra is infatuated with darkness (he comes across Maleficent in some pictures), it would probably be easier for him to some how summon Kingdom Hearts and fuse with Terra and become an apprentice.  From there, he is now known as Xehanort, rather than Master Xehanort because he's not a keyblade wielder anymore.  He forgets his memories, and then is discovered by Ansem the Wise.  Once Xehanort disobeys Ansem the Wise's rules and conducts experiments with the darkness in peoples hearts, he becomes Ansem and Xemnas.  Now Terra and Master Xehanort is split once again, but in a different form.  Master Xehanort is more of Ansem (hence the similar clothing), and Terra is more of Xemnas (hence the remembrance of Aqua).

Terra said something will happen to his body when he meets up with Master Xehanort and Braig
Terra said the he may need Ven to save him.

Now think back to a few trailers and here are some interesting things..

Terra tells Ven that he was saved by him once
MX does something to Ven's (heart?)
MX tells Ven to give something up

Now if you look at this it starts to fit together.

Something DOES happen to Terra's body and Ven saves him somehow. MX then focuses on getting Ven out of the picture which ends up with that scene where Terra asks what happened to his heart. MX will try again to do something to Terra as to what we don't know, and without Ven this time it might work.
+++++++++++++++++++

No just to add in a bit of theory...

It's possible that whatever happens to Terra is because of Ven falling into a trap and getting knocked out of the picture so he was unable to save Terra a 2nd time. Skipping a head I think it's possible that Destiny island scene with Ven and what looks to be Aqua might be the end of the game.

Because of Ven falling into a trap the existence of Terra is no longer Terra. In the end Ven tells aqua to erase him, because he feels guilty and wants to have his existence erased as well. Aqua does something to erase Ven and some part of ven becomes one with sora.

If you think about it this would be very appropriate. Because that could make it like this, the existance of Ven is no more and in his place is the non-existent Roxas, and the existence of Terra is no more and in his place is the non-existant Xemnas.

Personally with all the KH symbolism I could really see that possible.

Anyway yeah just was kinda thinking and seeing what I could piece together.}}

{{LOMI|Goji=I'm not very good at this due to the very little I know about Birth by Sleep, but I want to add in my two cents, so here it goes.

In the trailer I watched, I believe it was the first one, if memory serves correctly Master Xenahort tells Ven that he's loosing his heart: this, to me, suggest becoming a Heartless. However, what if MX isn't referring to Ven? What if it's Terra? Terra is seen with both Maleficent and MX, so what if MX made a mistake and created a darkness-controlled monster out of Vanitas, and then Terra joined him?

Upon further reading, MX is trying to gather Kingdom Hearts via the Princesses of Heart, and Terra ''does'' succumb to the darkness: what if ''Terra'' is the key to it all, and - pulling a Kairi almost - his heart becomes entrapped within Ven, therefore making Ven need to be "erased", i.e. killed in order for Terra to return and undo a mistake he made.

On the other hand, what if Ven's "erasing" is the end of the game: perhaps part of Terra becomes fused with Riku, and Ven asks to be erased so that he can do the same with Sora, after which Aqua does the same with Kairi. The Sora-Ven, Kairi-Aqua, and Terra-Riku connections are obviously there, and very likely have something to do with all three being able to use keyblades (as Nomura's stated previously that it's not something you can just "get")

Focusing on MX now, his connection with Xenahort is a curiosity for me, but here's my current (and faulty) idea: what if Xenahort/Ansem is Xenahort's "Nobody" so to speak, one much like Roxas, with the ability to feel and the like but without memories of their former self? MX would've been erased, but inevitably his new self would repeat the former's mistakes

I dunno, it's all very faulty: some might be possible, some not so much. Perhaps a wiser soul than I would have a good shot at it}}




This is my theory: It is possible for Xehanort to return but not in any of his previous forms. Master Xehanort released his heart and trasfered it to Terra. If that is the case then what happened to the resst of him, a.k.a. his body and soul. When Sora used the Keyblade of Peoples Hearts on him self in order to free Kairi's heart, Roxas was created in the process. If all the aformentioned information is correct, that would mean because Master Xehanort lost/gave up his heart there is a chance he will return as a Nobody. I bet your thinking "Wasn't Xemnas MX's Nobody?" No because that may have been MX's heart, it was also terra's body and soul the became Xemnas, while MX's body and soul are still out there. [[User:KeyToEterninty|KeyToEterninty]] 03:22, May 16, 2010 (UTC)KeyToEternity

== master xehanort boss battle ==

video of master xehanort boss battle with terra where he uses his own keyblade to release his heart and transorm terra into xehanort and after that terra's armour gets a will of his own. and after that the armour fights terra/xehanort
[[Video:Kingdom Hearts: Birth by Sleep secret boss: Master Xehanort HQ!|thumb|300px|left]]
[[Video:Kingdom Hearts: Birth by Sleep Final Boss   Secret Ending HQ!|thumb|300px|right]]

== Main antagonist ==

{{Randomnessity|text=Since MX is the Xehanort we know, and Xehanort's page calls hm=im the main antagonist of the series, wouldn't that make MX the main antagonist, and the fact that their pages are seperate pointless? I'm not saying add this to the article or merging, because I know about the spoiler policy, but I am putting it down for future reference.}}
{{LapisScarab|time=21:53, January 9, 2010 (UTC)|text=The Xehanort we know is a combination of MX and Terra, thus technically a different character. Terra's page should be about actions performed by Terra himself, MX's page should be about actions MX does himself, and Xehanort's page is for the combined being's actions. That said, it would seem that calling MX the main antagonist by proxy isn't far fetched.}}

It seemed Master Xehanort and Xehanort are the same but Master Xehanort stole Terra's body and become the Xehanort 9-10 years later. So are you going to merge Master Xehanort and Xehanort togther? --[[User:Cococrash11|Cococrash11]] 22:09, January 9, 2010 (UTC)Cococrash11
{{Randomnessity|text=To Lapis:Makes sense. To Cococrash:It probably wouldn't be the best idea. It would make it jumbled.}}

== Home World? The Hell? ==

{{NeutraVega|Why is the Keyblade Graveyard listed here?  What the hell.  How I seem to recall, he was born on Destiny Islands, and later moved to the Land of Departure.}}
:Forgive me for asking, but do you have a source? Someone went and changed it without verifying that it was actually correct, and now it is locked that way.--[[User:Otherarrow|Otherarrow]] 09:31, January 18, 2010 (UTC)

The Xehanort's Report in the game make mention of Master Xehanort sending Ven to his home to rest and recover the light in his heart, and this has been interpreted as when Ven is streaking down to the islands in the BBS intro. MX also makes reference to leaving while standing on a beach in his world, which is a pretty explicit reference when you consider that sort of visual has been used a lot in KH. [[User:Drake Clawfang|Doreiku Kuroofangu]] 11:44, January 18, 2010 (UTC)
{{GS|time=22:54, January 18, 2010 (UTC)|text=Also, it shows MX as his young self on Destiny Islands at the very start of the game.  That's the person that Terra sees Riku as for a split second.  In the scene with Riku and Terra, Riku even mentions that a boy left to travel to other worlds a long time ago.  That's how Riku knew there were other worlds in the first place.}}
{{NeutraVega|That settles it.  *goes to fix*}}

Wait a second wheres the proof that man and Master Xehanort are the same? I mean Riku didn't said in what year that the myteroius man leave? --[[User:Cococrash11|Cococrash11]] 05:56, January 20, 2010 (UTC)Cococrash11

[[:File:YoungMasterXehanort.JPG|Sure looks like a younger (Master) Xehanort]]. Here's the scene - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5yGqehqfm0A. As Riku stands there, Terra sees the guy Riku mentions as Riku himself, then Riku turns and looks like his KH2 self, and finally he looks like young Riku again. [[User:Drake Clawfang|Doreiku Kuroofangu]] 03:27, January 22, 2010 (UTC)

== Spoilers (merge) ==

I'm not saying ''do it right now'', because it would be a pretty massive spoiler just to do it, but do we want to consider eventually merging this with Xehanort's page? I've watched a couple BBS vids, and it's obvious that his name is simply Xehanort, as other characters refer to him without the title. So do we keep the page "Master Xehanort" for now and move/merge it to another location later, leave it here for good, or what? [[User:Drake Clawfang|Doreiku Kuroofangu]] 02:21, January 23, 2010 (UTC)

== BBS Template ==

{{Randomnessity|isa=Can an admin add the BBS template to the bottom of this page? He's the only page that doesn't have it.}}

== Master Xehanort's power ==

it's confirmed that he also very skillful in ice and lightning magic, shown by attacking using homing dark-ice spell. he also uses dark-lightning magic. also, he is able to raise the ground as a pillar for attacking. as for his battle stance, it's the same as vanitas' since vanitas is his apprentice


[[User:17master|17master]] 16:08, January 25, 2010 (UTC)

:And.......so? His battle stance is different from Vanitas', at least in the vid I saw where he is fought. [[User:Drake Clawfang|Doreiku]] [[User talk:Drake Clawfang|Kuroofangu]] 05:07, February 5, 2010 (UTC)

well I said so so the admins can go add it, the article was locked back then. it's the same, they both raise their keyblade the same way Riku did it. [[User:17master|17master]] 12:58, May 18, 2010 (UTC)

== Hometown? ==

{{Saxisai|time=[[User:Saxisai|Saxisai]] 18:16, February 6, 2010 (UTC)|saxisai=It indirectly states in the [[Xehanort's Report]] that his home town was Destiny Islands. Should we add this?}}

There's a lot we could add to the page, that included. [[User:Drake Clawfang|Doreiku]] [[User talk:Drake Clawfang|Kuroofangu]] 18:27, February 6, 2010 (UTC)
{{Saxisai|time=[[User:Saxisai|Saxisai]] 18:29, February 6, 2010 (UTC)|saxisai=Yea, why hasn't the lock been removed from this page yet?}}

== Main Antagonists ==

Can someone add Master Xehanort and [http://kingdomhearts.wikia.com/wiki/Vanitas Vanitas] to the list of main antagonists under Universe of Kingdom Hearts

== Okay, this isn't even funny anymore... ==

Someone has to find a way to unlock this page. Birth by sleep is over a month old now, and this page needs an update. Seriously. [[User:Xabrin|Xabrin]] 04:47, February 20, 2010 (UTC)Xabrin

Update: SUCCESS! BOO-YA! [[User:Xabrin|Xabrin]] 03:59, February 24, 2010 (UTC)Xabrin

Indeed. A massive update. For Pete's sake, they just showed us what Xehanort looked like before he got all wrinkly.

== Maybe I am just crazy, but... ==

Ok, well I was thinking that seems MX's body (and soul?) faded into darkness when his heart joined with Terra, forming Xehanort, That with the destruction of Ansem and Xemnas that Terra's heart will return to his body and MX's to his, reforming both of them for a future game. But I don't know I am a little crazy. [[User:Black Tornado|Black Tornado]] 20:54, February 23, 2010 (UTC)Black Tornado

== Master Xehanort isn't autistic.... ==

Seriously, who suggested that? The only kind that would fit is Asperger's, and Master Xehanort has displayed none of the other common behavioural problems associated with that. Autistics tend to face people, but not have eye contact with them, which is the exact opposite to how MX acts. My older brother's autistic, I know what I'm talking about when I say it should be removed from the trivia section. [[User:Xabrin|Xabrin]] 04:04, February 24, 2010 (UTC)Xabrin
:I'm sorry, that was me. I have asperger syndrome, and I thought the way Xehanort acted was actually the same as I did. I don't always make eye contact, and I at times tend to talk while my back is turned at the person I was speaking to. [[User:Werehog21|Werehog]] 1:34 PM 2/24/2010 (UTC)
::" don't always make eye contact, and I at times tend to talk while my back is turned at the person I was speaking to." As a part of characterization, that is called Dramatic Emphasis. Or shame. And MX definitely has plenty of both.

== Battles with Sora? ==

{{Rossello|time=03:54, February 25, 2010 (UTC)|text=There's a sentence in the abilities section that says something along the lines of "as evidenced of his battles with Sora." I don't think that belongs there. Master Xehanort never battled Sora as far as I know. In fact, the Xehanort showed in KH2 never battled him either. Only his heartless and his nobody did. If there are no objections within the next few days, I shall feel obliged to remove it.}}

{{R&D|time=04:08, February 25, 2010 (UTC)|text=It's not wrong. If you read the whole paragraph you will understand. It says that after he took Terra's body and lost his memories and Keyblade he was still dangerous, proved by the fights Sora had with him (his Heartless and Nobody.)}}
{{LapisScarab|time=04:11, February 25, 2010 (UTC)|text=Yeah, but Master Xehanort's abilities section should be about ''his'' abilities. The abilities of his Heartless, Nobody, and the other Xehanort should be contained on their respective pages.}}

{{Rossello|time=04:35, February 25, 2010 (UTC)|text=Yes, I did read the whole paragraph. And it's still wrong. Xehanort's Heartless is not Master Xehanort. Neither is Xemnas. They are different entities created from the heart of Master Xehanort, but different entities nonetheless. Calling them the same person, is like calling Kairi and Namine the same person. It's just not right. Plus, we have other articles for Xemnas and Xehanort's Heartless. And as the gentlemen above me stated earlier, this is about Master Xehanort's abilities. Not. Anyone. Else's. So, I'm just waiting for the OK to nuke that sentence.}}



{{Rossello|time=21:54, February 25, 2010 (UTC)|text=Since the only objection I have received has been disproven, I'm going to remove that statement. I will save it, in case anyone objects later.}}



{{Rossello|time=21:58, February 25, 2010 (UTC)|text=Never mind...the page is locked.}}

== islander? ==

Was it ever actually confermed that MX was from destiny's islands, because I do not think it was. If no one objects I going to take it down on Monday. [[User:Black Tornado|Black Tornado]] 20:31, March 4, 2010 (UTC)Black Tornado
::In a way, yes. A man that looks much like [[Xehanort]] was seen on Destiny Islands both in the beginning of ''BBS'' and when Riku talks with Terra on Destiny Islands. This is '''not''', however, the Xehanort from ''KH1'' or ''KH2'', because his hair is styled a different way, and his outfit is also different. Not to mention the apprentice Xehanort never sets foot on or in Destiny Islands, with the exception of his Heartless, a separate character. Please leave this bit of information alone. - [[User:EternalNothingnessXIII|EternalNothingnessXIII]] 20:35, March 4, 2010 (UTC)
Ya, but only see the back of that guy's head and for all we know it could be Riku from the "distant" future (after the KH2 version). Maybe it should say that it highly inferred in Bbs that MX is from Destiny's islands. Is that fair? [[User:Black Tornado|Black Tornado]] 21:25, March 5, 2010 (UTC)Black Tornado
::No, because that would make it sound more like speculation, even though all of this pretty much is. We have the most facts supporting that it is Xehanort, because the man is seen in the beginning saying "One day, I'll be free." When Terra meets Riku, he says "A man left the islands long ago." before Terra sees the man's form over Riku's. The verdict : Leave it be. We have more facts supporting that it's Xehanort. - [[User:EternalNothingnessXIII|EternalNothingnessXIII]] 21:28, March 5, 2010 (UTC)
Alright I'll leave it for now, but I am still against it. [[User:Black Tornado|Black Tornado]] 22:01, March 5, 2010 (UTC)Black Tornado
:The man has a different hair-color than Riku, and appears right as Riku is mentioning Master Xehanort as an islander. The implication is pretty clear.[[User:KrytenKoro|<small>Glorious</small>]] [[User_talk:KrytenKoro|<small>CHAOS!</small>]] 03:21, March 6, 2010 (UTC)
No Riku mentions ''someone'', who players speculate is MX he never says the name Xehanort[[User:Black Tornado|Black Tornado]] 16:17, March 6, 2010 (UTC)Black Tornado
:As Riku says this, we get a shot of Xehanort's back. I mean, christ.—[[User:Urutapu|Urutapu]] 23:25, March 6, 2010 (UTC)
YES the back of a head it could not possibly be anyone else!! [[User:Black Tornado|Black Tornado]] 16:02, March 7, 2010 (UTC)Black Torando

Um, it is young Master Xehanort, as the Xehanort's Report back this up, along with an interview with Tetsuya Nomura, and I think any smart person could figure it out.---[[User:oddishh|oddishh]]

Yes it is obviously MX, but, you weed, that requires deduction, which makes this speculation, need I say more? [[User:Black Tornado|Black Tornado]] 21:31, March 8, 2010 (UTC)Black Tornado
::...you see him clearly at the beginning of the game, then you see him again when Riku mentions a man that left the islands. Are you seriously saying it should be removed because you still need a map and compass?[[User:KrytenKoro|<small>Glorious</small>]] [[User_talk:KrytenKoro|<small>CHAOS!</small>]] 21:43, March 8, 2010 (UTC)
Did you just call me a 'weed?' xDDD And what Kryten said. If you can't figure it out, then it's your problem. It's pretty much common knowledge for those who read spoilers now. ---[[User:oddishh|oddishh]]

Hay you named yourself, not me and if you bothered to read what i said, YES MX is from Destiny Island, but no matter how you say IT IS SPECULATION!!!!!!...so yes i do need a map and compass because speculation does not belong in the articles [[User:Black Tornado|Black Tornado]] 21:39, March 9, 2010 (UTC)Black Tornado
:So I guess you ''don't'' play as Sora, and Organization member, Terra, Ven, or Aqua? I mean, everybody calls them by those names and such, but you only get a shot of their backs as you play.—[[User:Urutapu|Urutapu]] 11:00, March 11, 2010 (UTC)
That does not even deserve a responce, the fact that can not see the difference is so sad and makes me what to kill my self. [[User:Black Tornado|Black Tornado]] 21:24, March 11, 2010 (UTC)Black Tornado

Oi!You Black Tornado The Silver-haired male http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/kingdomhearts/images/a/a6/YoungMasterXehanort.JPG is MX it was confirmed by Nomura.And its clear that this dude is in Destiny Islands : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gmTXDbZ0yw8

== question ==

i have a question.


does anyone know how the heartless held down ventus when master xehanort unlocked his heart,if the heartless were not created back then?

:Pureblood have always existed, its Emblem's that weren't created yet.[[User:KrytenKoro|<small>Glorious</small>]] [[User_talk:KrytenKoro|<small>CHAOS!</small>]] 23:51, March 27, 2010 (UTC)
{{Rucario|time=05:04, April 1, 2010 (UTC)|text=Purebloods have existed for quadrillions of years.}}
{{Xabryn|text=Not exacly is not  so much time before bbs}}

== Leonard Nimoy Confirmed (99%...) ==
Reason why I said 99 instead of 100 is cause we've yet to hear HIM say anything.  Regardless, if you watch the short little Gamestop trailer/TV spot...  How do I put this?  As much as I appreciate a good argument, and the whole thing with "confirmations" and "validities", the fact is...no one in the world has that voice.  Same with Christopher Lee - you hear it, you know it.  And that's just that.  Link to the trailer: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qsGOig8sg4  Oh, and before I hear any nonsense...NO, this isn't a fake trailer... --[[User:NeutraVega|NeutraVega]] 06:31, May 15, 2010 (UTC)
::It's very likely and reasonable, but just for the sake of procedure, let's wait til we can cite it.[[User:KrytenKoro|<small>Glorious</small>]] [[User_talk:KrytenKoro|<small>CHAOS!</small>]] 21:50, May 15, 2010 (UTC)

That video has been confirmed to be fake...[[User:JTD95|JTD95]] 22:03, May 15, 2010 (UTC)
{{NeutraVega|Didn't I already say I better not see any of this fake bullshit?  And who has confirmed this as fake exactly?  Who has the power to denounce English gameplay footage with aforementioned changes made to it, alongside ''Leonard Frakking Nimoy's'' voice?  Please.  By all means.  Direct me to this all-knowing source that marks this indisputably as fake.}}
{{Maggosh|text=Apparently DChuich on YouTube does. He changed the title of their uploaded trailer which prompted the entire KHInsider community to denounce it as fake.}}
{{NeutraVega|SO, basically, a random person on the internet.  Good.  That's all I needed to hear.  Random guy on Youtube.  Hard-core evidence indeed.  There's absolutely no way true and tried English-version gameplay can go against the word of random internet dude.  Good to know.}}
DChuich is the KH13.com guy. Usually his vids are... well genuine.  --<span style="font-size:10pt">[[User:Neumannz|'''<span style="font-size=12pt; font-family:Gisha; color:#005400">Neumannz</span>''']], [[User talk:Neumannz|''<span style="color:black; font-family:Agency FB Bold">The Dark Falcon</span>'']]</span> 02:29, May 16, 2010 (UTC)

That trailer is confirmed to be real and is posted on the games website, and Leonard Nimoy has also been confirmed to be in the game with the PSP bundle article. I'd say it's pretty well confirmed.

{{NeutraVega|Yep.  Totally confirmed: http://www.joystiq.com/2010/05/17/kingdom-hearts-birth-by-sleep-coming-stateside-september-7/ }}

Along with Mark Hamill, Willa Holland, Jesse McCartney, and James Woods.--ShadowsTwilight 
18:49, May 17, 2010 (UTC)

Willa is most probably Aqua due to lack of any other main female characters in BBS. Dunno about Mark though.
:It's absolutely Nimoy. It ''shouldn't'' be Nimoy, but it is.[[User:KrytenKoro|<small>Glorious</small>]] [[User_talk:KrytenKoro|<small>CHAOS!</small>]] 19:03, May 17, 2010 (UTC)

It... "shouldn't"? Why shouldn't it? What's wrong with having Leonard Nimoy as Master Xehanort? If you think about it, he (As Spock, of course) kind of LOOK alike to me. Well... minus the beard, and all. [[User:Hyper Zander|Hyper Zander]] 19:27, May 17, 2010 (UTC)

I'll agree that Nimoy's voice is a little, for lack of a better word, rough compaired to the Jap Voice actor, however other than that it fits pretty well.  --Evnyofdeath 19:31, May 17, 2010 (UTC)

I don't know. I'm kinda on the fence about it.--[[User:No.i|No.i]] 19:37, May 17, 2010 (UTC)
::Nimoy has a very, for lack of a better descriptor "old sage" feel to his voice. He pretty much always has. He does ''not'' make a convincing "dastardly old man" voice, and it's just not at all the right tone for MX. Compare it to the Japanese. Could you ever see Spock with those evil eyes and smirk?
::He would probably do ''very well'' for Yen Sid, he has just the right feel for it. But for the series's ultimate villain? It was a terrible casting decision.[[User:KrytenKoro|<small>Glorious</small>]] [[User_talk:KrytenKoro|<small>CHAOS!</small>]] 20:32, May 17, 2010 (UTC)

Please note that they both have pointy ears. End of story. [[User:Maggosh|mag]][[User talk:Maggosh|gosh]] 20:37, May 17, 2010 (UTC)

{{NeutraVega|And a goatee of evil.}}

Found a website with confirmation of Nimoy [http://www.kh2.co.uk/ right here]. [[User:YamiNoBahamut|YamiNoBahamut]] 16:00, May 18, 2010 (UTC)

You're a little late, you know. They already did a press release with the official release of the trailer that said Leonard Nimoy, along with Jesse McCartney, a few other people and "among others", was a VA in the game yesterday. [[User:Hyper Zander|Hyper Zander]] 16:03, May 18, 2010 (UTC)

Then why has no-one added it to the page? [[User:YamiNoBahamut|YamiNoBahamut]] 17:14, May 18, 2010 (UTC)

Confirmation bias. Yeah, I know, it sucks, but this is Kingdom Hearts we're talkin' about here, so yeah x: [[User:Kaihedgie|Kaihedgie]] 17:32, May 18, 2010 (UTC)

Right, I messaged him on Twitter so we'll have confirmation soon enough [[User:YamiNoBahamut|YamiNoBahamut]] 17:54, May 18, 2010 (UTC)

{{NeutraVega|And I'm just gonna go riiiight ahead and ignore confirmation bias considering all the bullshit I got when I said "Let's wait for a confirmation..." regarding Vanitas...}}

{{NeutraVega|Oh, and for the record, I could really care less which route you all taking - as long as it's consistent.  And so far, consistency is a flat-out clusterfuck around here.  Un-sourced bias, proper citations...good arguments.  If you all stuck to the arguments' principles as much as your stuck to the arguments' word content!  Cause the fact is, you've all done the direct fucking opposite with a good number of other pages.  Kirk Thornton, for example - Give me a "proper cited source" that explicitly details that he's voiced the character by the name of Isa.  I can god-fucking-damn guarantee you it's no different than is the case for this.  So, until there's some consistency around here...Leonard Nimoy stays.  Since, contrary to your words, is the trend around here...}}
:Okay,so right now I'm seeing [[Grand Duke]], [[Magic Mirror]], [[Grumpy]], [[Prince Phillip]], [[Master Xehanort]], and [[Scrooge McDuck]] as claimed VA's without an explicit citation. Isa was directly confirmed by Kirk on Facebook, so that's good. Am I missing any? 'cause those can be fixed quickly.[[User:KrytenKoro|<small>Glorious</small>]] [[User_talk:KrytenKoro|<small>CHAOS!</small>]] 21:25, May 18, 2010 (UTC)

We locked Vanitas' page for the purpose of keeping people from speculating about his VA, so I don't know what you're talking about there. You could just remove the unsourced VAs yourself, you know.--'''''[[User:LapisScarab|<span style="color:navy;">Lapis of</span>]][[User talk:LapisScarab|<span style="color:darkred;">the Night</span>]]''''' 21:35, May 18, 2010 (UTC)

{{NeutraVega|My bad.  I guess I missed the Facebook confirmation.  As for the others, yeah.  I say we just go with the majority, since people don't really pay attention to consistency.}}
::I removed most of them, since there was no announcement that they were even doing the game, much less those characters. People had just said "Well, they did it in the movie, and obviously these people are blood-thralls of Disney, so they'll be forced to come back." All that's left is Master Xehanort...so consistency says revert to TBA.[[User:KrytenKoro|<small>Glorious</small>]] [[User_talk:KrytenKoro|<small>CHAOS!</small>]] 01:06, May 19, 2010 (UTC)

{{Maggosh|text=And I did that, what, Tuesday? And it was reverted?}}

== Xehanorts voice actor ==

it has been confirmed in the english trailer it is leoard nimoy who is the voice actor for master xehanort

We know that. It's just that the wiki's policy is to wait for 100%, explicit confirmation before putting up info. That means a statement saying something along the lines of "Leonard Nimoy is voicing Master Xehanort in ''Kingdom Hearts Birth by Sleep''." It's mainly a formality, so just be patient.{{User:LapisScarab/Sig}}05:41, May 24, 2010 (UTC)

Why was Leonard Nimoy removed from Master Xehanorts english voice when it is confirmed here: http://forums.khinsider.com/future-kingdom-hearts/151133-new-degenki-interview.html#post5144428 ? - [[User:JTD95|JTD95]] 21:45, July 7, 2010 (UTC)

: Extension on JTD95's point - the original Japanese article is [http://www.ff-reunion.net/kh/2010/06/25/khbbs_dengeki_nomura_interview here] [[User:YamiNoBahamut|YamiNoBahamut]] 22:54, July 7, 2010 (UTC)


Regardin' that lil' trivia piece regardin' his English voice actor. It kinda needs to be kept there as there is a both a dichotomy and a relationship between Star Trek and Star Wars [[User:Kaihedgie|Kaihedgie]] 06:44, July 13, 2010 (UTC)

== Young Xehanort pic? ==

I got this from a print screen, it still shows his back but not as close as the one before. maybe if you guys like it you can replace it. but it's just a suggestion though [[File:Young MX.jpg|thumb]]

{{Maggosh|text=I'll do you one better.<br>[[File:Young MX Full.png|thumb|left]]}}

awesomely done, thanks Maggosh [[User:17master|17master]] 17:00, June 20, 2010 (UTC)

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{{LapisScarab|time=01:28, August 26, 2010 (UTC)|text=Appreciate the nethusiasm, but the article talk pages are supposed to be used to discuss improving the article. If you want to share your opinion, create a forum or put it on your user page.}}

== Young Master Xehanort's voice ==

Young Master Xehanort sounds like he has the same voice actor as Riku. But it doesn't say in the credit who is voiced by though... - [[User:JTD95|JTD95]] 18:58, September 4, 2010 (UTC)

== Young Xehanort/Terra similarties ==

First off, I just know I misspelled the word "similarities". Secondly, From looking at the render of the Young Xehanort on the page, isn't it uncanny how closly he resembles Terra? The only real difference I can see is Skin and Hair color, and Young Xehanort's hair is longer and in a slightly different style. --Evnyofdeath 05:31, September 12, 2010 (UTC)

== Gallery What Belongs? ==

{{iZerox|time=05:32, September 12, 2010 (UTC)|hooded=Hey guys I want opinions on this as KrytenKoro apparently is not desirous to have both images in the gallery, though 3 images is hardly taking up too much space. Today I added an image of Young Master Xehanort from the front. Though this was an image dumped from the game files rather than something easily visible in-game. The only time you see Young Master Xehanort in-game is from behind. And as such I find it only reasonable that the image showing how he appears in-game be kept despite another image showing his face and such for a better understanding of his character's appearance.

This is how I believe the gallery should appear:

<gallery>
File:Master Xehanort (Young) KHBBS.png|Master Xehanort in his youth.
File:Young MX Full.png|Master Xehanort, seen from behind while in his youth, on Destiny Islands.
File:Kingdom Hearts 02 KHIIFM.png|Master Xehanort summoning Kingdom Hearts in the [[Birth by sleep (video)|secret ending]]
</gallery>

KrytenKoro is removing the last two images making a very empty gallery space and they illustrate concepts and actual in-game images. I really think that both images of Young Master Xehanort need to be kept. Even if all we do is bump the image of Young Master Xehanort up to his appearance section rather than the gallery. Besides the in-game image showing him from behind illustrates that he has long hair and this isn't easily visible in a frontal view. I think it's an important contrast to see how he had an abundance of hair in his youth and lost all of it in his elderly years. But even so what reason is there to remove the 3rd image? It was fine there before why remove it now? We don't need to have our pages so bare looking.}}
{{GS|time=06:10, September 12, 2010 (UTC)|text=I personally don't care if you keep the second one or not, though I feel that the third one is unnecessary.  There's no reason you should worry about the page looking bare.  Simplicity is still appealing, and I don't think we should be adding a bunch of unnecessary images to the gallery just to look pretty.}}
{{KrytenKoro|If we had the full screen for the latter two images, and used them as screenshots in the plot synopsis, that would be fine, but as they are, they only serve to illustrate things that are better illustrated by previous images.

That's my take on it, anyway.}}

{{iZerox|time=22:06, September 12, 2010 (UTC)|text=Thank you Guardian Soul for agreeing. I don't really have a reason for keeping the last one though. But I believe the second should be kept. 

As for your reasoning KrytenKoro there isn't already an image in the article illustrating his summoning of Kingdom Hearts. 
That and it looks quite full sized to me. Though due to your full screen theory I got another image of Master Xehanort on Destiny Islands.
<gallery>
File:The Boy Who Sought the World 01 KHBBS.png
</gallery>
Personally I prefer the other image as it's more of a close up. Besides this has him way off to the side.}}

== Reference ==

Is the reference for the quote really needed? BbS has been already out for a week. [[User:The Yoshiman 97|The Yoshiman 97]] 01:25, September 16, 2010 (UTC)

:What reference? *shifty eyes* Yeah, it's removed. [[User:Maggosh|mag]][[User talk:Maggosh|gosh]] 01:30, September 16, 2010 (UTC)

== Quotes ==

{{Nevfx|time=Here and now|text=Im glad my idea of adding the Quotes section was well recieved. Yes I know my first quote was incorrect, I just wanted to start the section off. XD}}.

== Re: Coded ==

{{iZerox|time=03:15, October 7, 2010 (UTC)|sad=So... Why can't the Re: Coded part be in this article? Heck it's got a full video source I don't think it gets any better than that.}}
:Because (1) the video is hacked, and translated by a group that, while certainly dedicated and admirable, has consistently mistranslated important texts, leading to confusion in the community (KH3, for example), and (2) the section that is put up is consistently in a badly written "out-of-universe" style. Like all synopsis sections, it should be written as if you were a character in the games, describing what was going on.[[User:KrytenKoro|<small>Why don't you try it just to see</small>]] [[User_talk:KrytenKoro|<small>what happens?</small>]] 04:00, October 7, 2010 (UTC)
::KH13 explicitly states the video was ''recorded'', not hacked. The mistranslation and bad writing I agree with, however. [[User:Maggosh|mag]][[User talk:Maggosh|gosh]] 04:01, October 7, 2010 (UTC)
:::...how did they record it on the day the game came out? There's no way SE released a game that short.[[User:KrytenKoro|<small>Why don't you try it just to see</small>]] [[User_talk:KrytenKoro|<small>what happens?</small>]] 12:49, October 7, 2010 (UTC)
::::It's highly possible for someone to finish a game the day of. I've seen it done myself. [[User:Maggosh|mag]][[User talk:Maggosh|gosh]] 13:08, October 7, 2010 (UTC)
::::okay. Could you give me a link to where they said they got it legitimately?[[User:KrytenKoro|<small>Why don't you try it just to see</small>]] [[User_talk:KrytenKoro|<small>what happens?</small>]] 13:40, October 7, 2010 (UTC)

Well...isn't there an error in the Coded-Section? As far as I remember Mickey said they might've located Ventus' Heart, not Ventus himself. The only ones who should know where Ven's body and soul are located are Aqua and maybe Xemnas...and we don't know yet if Mickey has met Aqua in the Realm of Darkness.
However, given the fact that the translation of the conversation might be off or partly wrong Mickey might even have said something other regarding Ven... [[Special:Contributions/93.223.151.73|93.223.151.73]] 12:22, October 13, 2010 (UTC)

==Return==
{{ST|text=ok, this is something this wiki needs to settle so we can avoid confusion on the articles: are we going to say that it is Maseter Xehanort or Xehanort returning? I say if we say Xehanort without any links that way it can mean either one, but if we had to choose one i say Xehanort because yen sid said that his return was due to his heartless and nobody being defeated and since the nobody in question was terra's body, it would make sense that that was the body the heart would join with. if it was to join with master xehanort's original body, it most likely would have done so after ansem was defeated, with xemnas' defeat contributing nothing to his return. just my two cents.}}

{{17m|time=16:10, October 11, 2010 (UTC)|text= I think when Yen Sid said Xehanort's return, he's referring to the body of Terra and Xehanort's mind. See, we can say that there are 3 minds in Terra's body. Terra's, Xehanort's, and Master Xehanort's. And when Yen Sid said MX's return, he was saying that MX literally returns along with Terra's body. But it's still unknown who will took control of Terra's body}}

{{CaelumLucisCaliga|time=20:01, October 11, 2010 (UTC)|videogame=I believe Xehanort as a whole (meaning the Xehanort whose Heartless is "Ansem" and Nobody is Xemnas). Probably near the end, MX and Terra will separate again somehow, but that's just a guess.}}
{{Sac|text=There is one thing I really want to know. What will happen to Terra's heart? It was in Xehanort when he was consumed by darkness and split up in a Heartless and a Nobody. But now that Master Xehanort is back, where is Terra's heart?}}
{{ST|text=I think it either stuck with xehanort's heart and resided within Ansem, somehow unaffected by the darkness, or it was released/cast out of xehanort when he was split into two. i think the latter is most likely due to Yen Sid making the mention of still needing to find terra's heart}}

I'm willing to be my left foot that when Xehanort returns it will be in "the younger new body" and for Sac terra's heart is likely in riku did you notice how he used relatively the same pose as Terra when you get him as a party member in WTNW but I digress. He's likely to return as new xehanort get separated from Terra's body and somehow be revived as in his own body that somehow became younger. Xander19[http://infamous.wikia.com/wiki/User:Xander19]

== add/change ==

can you add riku's english and japanese voice actors as young master xehanort and change section title of coded into Re: coded, please thanks.

{{Maggosh|nathan=Source?}}
 yes, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Gallagher#Filmography and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Characters_of_Kingdom_Hearts#Main_antagonists

{{Maggosh|flint=<nowiki>*</nowiki>sigh* A REAL source?}}
 I only got wikipedia, sorry

== Trivia Mishap..? ==

It says in the Trivia section of MX's page that Terra was foreshadowing Ansem Seeker of Darkness's demise when he said MX will be shown the door. I think that's reading too far into the statement. How could Terra have possibly known that 1)MX would become a Heartless, 2)Kingdom Hearts would contain light, and 3)it would destroy him? Terra is not psychic, nor is Master Eraqus, in case anyone claims he might have told Terra of the future.
I propose that Terra was using the common phrase "Showing someone the door," meaning making the concerned party leave. This would mean Terra was trying to say that he was the proper owner of his heart, that he wouldn't give up, and that he would kick MX out and regain control. That MX would be shown the way out. Anyone agree?
[[User:Seekerofdarkness|Seekerofdarkness]] 23:08, January 6, 2011 (UTC)seeker of darkness

:I do honestly agree, it's kind of a giant speculation. But people seem to like it. {{User:Soxra/Sig|t=11:09pm, January 6, 2011 (UTC)}}

{{Maggosh|nathan=''How could Terra have possibly known...''

He didn't. Foreshadowing ≠ Clairvoyance.}}

::Just because Terra had no idea what would happen to Ansem, SoD, doesn't mean it's not foreshadowing. Just because Terra possibly forshadowed something doesn't mean he had to know it would happen. However, I believe I tried removing that in the past, but someone put it back up, I guess. {{User:Chitalian8/Sig}} 23:16, January 6, 2011 (UTC)

I understand that clairvoyance and foreshadowing are not the same. The whole psychic thing was rather unrelated, in hindsight.
But I still maintain that the reference to the comment as foreshadowing is a bit of a stretch.
[[User:Seekerofdarkness|Seekerofdarkness]] 23:20, January 6, 2011 (UTC)seekerofdarkness
:What does he say in the original? That's not an idiom in Japanese, as far as I know, so if they squeezed it in there as well, it's purposeful. If it's not, then it's nonsense, just as it looks like.{{User:KrytenKoro/Sig}} 00:01, January 7, 2011 (UTC)

No idea. Anyone have the source on that?
[[User:Seekerofdarkness|Seekerofdarkness]] 23:42, January 7, 2011 (UTC)

{{Chitalian8|time=21:49, January 10, 2011 (UTC)|cecil= [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lt77rbjIYN4] Skip to 1:05, he just says "I'm kicking you out of here."}}

==Possibly Master Xehanort's Report?==
{{WB|Ven=During the FMV, Msster Xehanort is about to attack Sora and Riku. Then Mickey attacks Xehanort in the last minute. But, there Master Xehanort turns into a pile of papers.

Now this is only on my point of view and own speculation. But, I think those papers are Master Xehanort's Reports.}}
{{Asif|shonormal=I'm pretty sure Nomura said in an interview that it is sheet music, being generated by a silhouette of Mickey Mouse on the 3DS's bottom screen.}}

I heard that too. Does that mean music going to be a big part of the game? [[User:Unknown3619|Unknown3619]] 17:19, 16 February 2012 (UTC)

== Who is revived? ==

{{Sac|time=15:22, 16 February 2012 (UTC)|xemnas=Who is actually revived? Master Xehanort or Xehanort in his form of Terra-Xehanort.}}

who can tell right now? As seen on the last trailer, every form of xehanort will appear. wait for the next issue of jump, maybe they'll reveal it. [[User:Sum2k3|Sum2k3]] 15:41, 16 February 2012 (UTC)

It would seem likely that it would be Terra-Xehanort, as Terra's body is the one that made up Xemnas in the first place. But it still isn't really known. {{User:LightRoxas/Sig}} 19:53, 16 February 2012 (UTC)

== Nobody. ==

Wait!!! So when MX stabed himself with his keyblade and relesed his heart like sora did in KH1 then does that mean a Nobody was created too? ! Could it be the Unknown? ! Is that why the unknown resembles MX in his youth? is this plausable? [[User:Unknown3619|Unknown3619]] 15:31, 20 February 2012 (UTC)

A better way to put it: The mysterious man who has the form of young master xehanort is the mysterious man from bbs. Young Master Xehanort in DDD will not be the same YMX as the one from bbs such as how Roxas and Ven aren't the same person. [[User:Unknown3619|Unknown3619]] 15:35, 20 February 2012 (UTC)

That seems plausible. {{User:LightRoxas/Sig}} 19:50, 20 February 2012 (UTC)

I would say this should be on a [[Forum:Index|forum]]--{{User:Dark-EnigmaXIII/Sig}} 20:16, 20 February 2012 (UTC)

== Young English VA Improperly Sourced ==

As I said in the edit summary, the vid is from 2012, and David Gallagher says he provides the voice of a young Xehanort in a game that isn't out yet. It may of course still be him doing the brief young MX scene in BBS, but using that vid as a source for it is incorrect. [[Special:Contributions/174.88.14.63|174.88.14.63]] 05:32, 21 May 2012 (UTC)
:He probably either got his facts wrong or he misspoke. - [[User:JTD95|JTD95]] 06:06, 21 May 2012 (UTC)
:Regardless of the exact game he was referring to, he said he voiced young Xehanort. A young Xehanort is a young Xehanort, and I'm kind of feeling that we should merge the two articles anyway, unless the young's ''exact'' nature (he's basically a Heartless, is that right?) is a stumbling block.{{User:KrytenKoro/Sig}} 14:25, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

::"He probably either got his facts wrong or he misspoke." - And who are we to decide that? If we're going to start twisting what he said and assuming he meant something else, how do we know he didn't mean "I voice Master Xehanort and they just credited Leonard Nimoy as the VA to get people interested".
::"Regardless of the exact game he was referring to, he said he voiced young Xehanort. A young Xehanort is a young Xehanort" - Um, no. It isn't right to apply statements made about one game to another, especially concerning voice acting in this series. After all, if the KH series does one thing, it's always use the same voice actors for the same characters between games, right? [[Special:Contributions/174.88.14.63|174.88.14.63]] 16:30, 21 May 2012 (UTC)
:...instead of getting snarky, please review what is actually stated on the page: that David Gallagher voiced Xehanort (young), fullstop. You are the only one making any claims about what game he voiced the young Xehanort in. All we (and the article) are saying is what he said: that he voiced the young Xehanort. Please read more carefully next time, before making false accusations against other editors.{{User:KrytenKoro/Sig}} 18:31, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

::Apologies, I misread, I assumed that as the Nimoy credit has a tag that the tag also referred to the secondary VA. I was consumed and mistaken, sorry. I'll also note that VA debates on upcoming games are something of my berserk button and I got carried away, I'm aware that doesn't excuse my behavior though. [[Special:Contributions/174.88.14.63|174.88.14.63]] 19:47, 21 May 2012 (UTC)
:::'s fine, 's fine, we certainly appreciate your dedication to making sure the facts are right. Hell, I embarass myself doing way worse every month.{{User:KrytenKoro/Sig}} 20:40, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

==My critique==
{{EO|time=01:37, 24 February 2012 (UTC)|text=My critique:
*The ''Kingdom Hearts 3D: Dream Drop Distance'' sub-heading should be moved from "Other Appearances" and into a "Story" section. The story should also cover a ''Kingdom Hearts Birth by Sleep'' section, since his appearance in the game is within the story's canon. If we're making this a more ''KH3D''-driven article rather than relevant to every appearance of the character, we may wish to consider simply putting ''BBS'' under "Other Appearances." 
*Remove the hooded render from ''BBSFM'' from the gallery and create a Game:Unknown article in which we would feature the image and all strategies for the boss fight in ''BBS''. Obviously, ''KH3D'' boss information would be added if applicable.
}}
{{KrytenKoro|That's not what "Other appearances" is for. It's for non-canon but in-franchise material, like Kingdom Hearts Mobile or trailers. Otherwise, yes.}}
{{EO|time=11:37, 24 February 2012 (UTC)|shocked=But ''KH3D'' ''is'' canon...}}
{{LightRoxas|text=But so far all we have from KH3D is trailers, aside from a couple magazine articles. Our information on this guy is fairly limited, so until we have some actual details it should stay as is.}}
can we find a better picture of fix this one? the outline is blurry and his shoe has a "u" on it. [[User:Unknown3619|Unknown3619]] 15:05, 24 February 2012 (UTC)
{{KrytenKoro|KH3D is. The ''trailers'', which is all we have access to now, are not. We have an [[Removed content in the Kingdom Hearts series|entire article]] evincing how non-canon they are.

Unknown: That image is cropped from the Famitsu magazine. It is the only render we have now, and will be replaced as soon as higher-quality images become available.}}

what about the one on my profile page?[[User:Unknown3619|Unknown3619]] 18:06, 24 February 2012 (UTC)
:Is not a full-body render.{{User:KrytenKoro/Sig}} 09:51, 4 March 2012 (UTC)

==Template==
Why in God's name does this guy still have the Boss Template on his normal page when EVERYONE ELSE has that (still cocked-up) "new" template?? That's my reasoning but for some reason, this guy's the odd one out when it comes to templates. [[User:EnglishJoker|EnglishJoker]] 11:56, 6 March 2012 (UTC)
:Well, change it then. Don't complain. ;) [[User:UxieLover1994|UxieLover1994]] 12:15, 6 March 2012 (UTC)
::Alright, then I will......''again''. Watch what happens next. [[User:EnglishJoker|EnglishJoker]] 13:11, 6 March 2012 (UTC)

== New Japanese Name? ==

{{Pea14733|time=15:42, 22 March 2012 (UTC)|mrhintr= From [[http://images.khinsider.com/2012%20Uploads/03/Famitsu%20-%20March%2022/10.jpg]]
It's seem that he has a new name, {{nihongo|'''Enigmatic Young Man'''|謎の青年|Nazo no Seinen}} }}
:Enigmatic Youth or Boy.{{User:KrytenKoro/Sig}} 16:40, 22 March 2012 (UTC)

== Identity? ==

Could he be Terra, after Xehanort became a Heartless and nobody? --[[User:Sapphowako|Sapphowako]] 14:12, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

:Unlikely, the face is way off. He looks much more like young Master Xehanort.  --{{User:Neumannz/SigTemplate}} 14:36, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

We don't know what he is, he could very well have taken the appearence of a Young Xehanort, in BBS he was bigger than he is in 3D, either way the game is like 4 days way from the Japanese release let's just wait and see.--[[User:Xabryn|Xabryn]] 15:00, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

2 days is too long, the suspense is killing me, I wanna know how off I am... --[[User:Sapphowako|Sapphowako]] 00:02, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

Pretty damn off...

== Alternate Timeline ==

Source? And don't argue using logic, this is kinda the wrong series, and game for that.

There is no evidence that his time shenanigans are not based on a stable time loop, like most Final Fantasy games. Mentioning changes to the timeline is presumptuous.[[Special:Contributions/152.27.34.107|152.27.34.107]] 12:05, 2 April 2012 (UTC)

:He explicitly explains to Riku that one cannot alter the past through time travel. It's a stable time loop. Nothing ever changed. [[Special:Contributions/68.9.233.144|68.9.233.144]] 23:28, 2 April 2012 (UTC)

== Too Early ==

Wasn't the move a bit too early? the name of the article became a spoiler to the guy's identity.
:EDIT: Almost a week and no reply. Does anyone care about the spoiler police?{{User:Xabryn/Sig}} 02:23, 9 April 2012 (UTC}
::Thing is, if you go to a wiki, wouldn't you expect to be spoiled? {{User:Erry/Sig}} 19:09, 16 April 2012 (UTC)
:::This is only as much a spoiler as having articles for Quasimodo or CLU.[[Special:Contributions/192.249.47.177|192.249.47.177]] 19:37, 16 April 2012 (UTC)
If we followed that logic Erry we wouldn't have a spoiler police. And anon Quasimodo's identity isn't a secret, while YX's is, there is a reason why he was called unknown at first.{{User:Xabryn/Sig}}23:35, 16 April 2012 (UTC)
:The game's been out for at least two weeks, no? Then we're all set. Too late to change it back now. {{User:Chitalian8/Sig}} 23:37, 16 April 2012 (UTC)
::It is still a spoiler until the game is released in all countries, and no, it's not too late.--{{User:Xabryn/Sig}}01:05, 17 April 2012 (UTC)
:::Indeed, you are correct, my mistake. However, this is the first occasion where the name of an article itself is possibly spoiling. Not sure really how to handle this, but I don't think changing the name would be a good idea. I can't see any suitable solution besides keeping the spoiler tags up there. {{User:Chitalian8/Sig}} 01:19, 17 April 2012 (UTC)
::::Again, it's still as much a "secret" as Quasimodo being in the game is, even if certain players care about it more. Material from before the game was released clearly depicted them, the info's out there.
::::I mean, there's a point at which the spoiler policy goes from "common courtesy" to "shooting ourselves in the foot", and I think this is it. We can have a spoiler warning at the very top of the page, but it's not reasonable to start contorting the presentation of information and sacrificing accuracy on a crap-ton of pages.{{User:KrytenKoro/Sig}} 02:40, 17 April 2012 (UTC)

...Being in the game is not a spoiler. Being Xehanort, however, is.[[Special:Contributions/152.27.34.107|152.27.34.107]] 12:59, 19 April 2012 (UTC)

== English Voice Actor Clarification ==

Just wanted to quickly clarify than the english voice actor is [http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0228356/ Ben Diskin].  Don't put anything down yet though - not until "official" confirmation.  --[[Special:Contributions/68.230.252.5|68.230.252.5]] 15:55, 15 May 2012 (UTC)
:I love how you talk about waiting for something official, yet you post a link to iMDB. [[User:Maggosh|mag]][[User talk:Maggosh|gosh]] 16:03, 15 May 2012 (UTC)
::You got some proof to that, besides iMDB? {{User:Erry/Sig}} 17:30, 15 May 2012 (UTC)
:The hell?  I just posted the IMDB link so you'd get an idea of what he did in the past...  Not as any kind of proof.  As to how I know it's him?  ''I just do''.  He has one of those insanely ''recognizable'' voices.  Kinda like...you know, Spock himself?  --[[Special:Contributions/68.230.252.5|68.230.252.5]] 19:30, 15 May 2012 (UTC)
::So you have no confirmation. [[User:Maggosh|mag]][[User talk:Maggosh|gosh]] 19:35, 15 May 2012 (UTC)
:::Is it possible for you to not act like a grade A douchebag for five minutes?  No, really.  If you CAN just spare a few minutes, I think that'd be super.  When you get your confirmation, I'll make it a point to badger you specifically.--[[Special:Contributions/68.230.252.5|68.230.252.5]] 19:42, 15 May 2012 (UTC)
::::Look, we can't add him as his voice actor on a hunch. [[User:Maggosh|mag]][[User talk:Maggosh|gosh]] 19:49, 15 May 2012 (UTC)
:::::Well, I did say not to - ''yet''.  I just said it as such so the reason to dance around it would be eliminated.  Kind of like...how we all know Paul Peter is still voicing Xemnas, but we don't have ''official'' confirmation.--[[Special:Contributions/68.230.252.5|68.230.252.5]] 19:56, 15 May 2012 (UTC)
::::::Yeah, but Peter has worked on previous games. I don't even know who Diskin is. [[User:Maggosh|mag]][[User talk:Maggosh|gosh]] 20:00, 15 May 2012 (UTC)
:::::::So now it's all about ''you'' and what ''you'' know?--[[Special:Contributions/68.230.252.5|68.230.252.5]] 22:52, 15 May 2012 (UTC)
::::::::''Jaaayzus'', children.
:Anon: there's no point in even bringing up imdb, ever. They thought that James Earl Jones would be voicing Aqua. If you don't have a reliable source to provide, there's no reason to be starting new topics on the "what needs fixing on the article" page. Go to the forums, instead.[[Special:Contributions/192.249.47.177|192.249.47.177]] 22:58, 15 May 2012 (UTC)
::Also, I'd appreciate it if you didn't go around calling our editors douche bags. {{User:LightRoxas/Sig}} 00:24, 16 May 2012 (UTC)
:::Anyway, the point is that IMDb is not a reliable source, so it cannot be used. Even recognizing a voice actor's voice isn't proof, because many voice actors/actresses can sound the same. Take example Mickey's new English voice actor after Wayne Allwine (may he RIP).--{{User:NinjaSheik/Sig}} 00:29, 16 May 2012 (UTC)
I will admit it does sound like Benjamin Diskin, however David Gallagher's facebook and twitter says he is voiceing YX in KHDDD. David Gallagher is just shifting his voice just like Haily Joel Osment did when he voiced Vanitas. Also it makes no sense for YX NOT to be voiced by David Gallager because it was confirmed that he voiced him in BBS, David Gallagher already works for Square Enix as a voice actor. why would he deny the role? And please dont call people names on the wiki. readers can look at talk pages too and you want to make this wiki look professional dont you? [[Special:Contributions/198.209.0.252|198.209.0.252]] 14:21, 17 May 2012 (UTC)
:http://img40.imageshack.us/img40/4362/kh3dben.png  ''Whoops''.  --[[Special:Contributions/68.230.252.5|68.230.252.5]] 20:57, 17 May 2012 (UTC)
::I don't think that's enough. Although he admitted he did some work on it, he never specially side what ''kind'' of work on it. If we're on things based on assumptions, then we're just speculating. And, anonymous user, please don't "badger" our users.--{{User:NinjaSheik/Sig}} 21:02, 17 May 2012 (UTC)
:Of course.  I 100% anticipated this response.  Common sense, after all, isn't terribly popular here.  Should I run some sort of poll or something on every KH website and board to see how many people think of you guys as a joke?  Or, if I'm not mistaken, someone else already did that once...  IN FACT...there was a group called "The Blox" who completely showed you all up.  And you've ''yet'' to learn your lesson still.  You've yet to even bother improving.  It would be quite impressive, if it wasn't so sad.--[[Special:Contributions/68.230.252.5|68.230.252.5]] 21:15, 17 May 2012 (UTC)
::Now you're just acting plain rude. We need hardcore proof, not something based on assumptions. Better to be safe than sorry, as the saying goes. If other people wants to put on their websites that blah blah is voicing whatever character, that's fine because it's not how we do things at the wiki. Unless someone flat out says they're voicing a character, then it's nothing more than speculation. It's not that we're being unfair, we're being logical.--{{User:NinjaSheik/Sig}} 21:34, 17 May 2012 (UTC)
:::Then I suppose our definitions of logic greatly differ.  I see no logic in this.  You're working along the same lines of a system that is broken to no end.--[[Special:Contributions/68.230.252.5|68.230.252.5]] 21:43, 17 May 2012 (UTC)
::Stuff like this has happened before. We're just being careful, there's no harm in that. The game is coming out soon, anyway. I don't see a point of arguing over something that doesn't really to be argue about.--{{User:NinjaSheik/Sig}} 21:46, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

Alright, guys. I know I'm intruding, but seeing as how this argument has gone too far (in my opinion), allow me to provide my opinion on the matter.

Anon, I admit that it is very likely that Ben Diskin is the voice actor for Young Xehanort. With the image you've given, it does seem likely. However, this situation also brings back memories of what happened before ''Kingdom Hearts Birth by Sleep'' came out. After Mark Hammil was announced to be providing his voice for the game, I saw at least one website that stated that he would be playing Terra. Although it may have seemed likely at the time, we now know that Mark Hammil played Master Eraqus instead. Similarly, it was announced multiple weeks ago that Leonard Nimoy would not be reprising his role as Master Xehanort. Seeing as how Ben Diskin only stated that he "did SOME kind of work for it", he ''technically'' could be playing Master Xehanort in this game, rather than Young Xehanort.

I know my example may not seem likely at all, but until someone explicitly states that Ben Diskin is playing Young Xehanort, I do not believe that it is right to list him as his voice actor. The chance that he is playing a different role may seem slim, but so long as it exists I do not believe that it is right to list him as Young Xehanort's official voice actor. And after all, how do we know that he isn't being played by David Gallagher again, seeing as how that's who played the role in ''Kingdom Hearts Birth by Sleep''? --{{User:As if!/Autosig}} 22:23, 17 May 2012 (UTC)



:<big>NOTICE</big>
*There will be no more personal attacks, or I will begin handing out immediate indefinite bans.
*There will be no more fiddling around on this topic other than someone providing evidence where Ben Diskin is ''explicitly'' stated to have a certain role, or Young Xehanort is ''explicitly'' stated to have a certain actor.
**This wiki has had a policy of requiring explicit evidence for a good while now, and past violations are ''not'' an excuse for further incidents. Furthermore, the reliability of askance hints or IMDB have been ''thoroughly'' destroyed in the past. We do all remember Leonard Nimoy saying he was done with voice acting, right? How'd that turn out. And for imdb, the James Earl Jones thing.
*If we ''never'' get an explicit statement of who voices Young Xehanort, guess what? It doesn't fucking matter, because even if we did get it it would be a tiny, irrelevant footnote hidden away on the page. This is a ridiculous thing for people to be getting worked up about.{{User:KrytenKoro/Sig}} 22:44, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

And, anonymous user, please don't "badger" our users
Badger? no you misunderstand. you see im just a wiki critic who tells people on my website what wiki to use for the best info. I find this site however.... distasteful.
---> If we ''never'' get an explicit statement of who voices Young Xehanort, guess what? It doesn't fucking matter (case and point) bye ;)

{{neumannz|time=00:09, 19 May 2012 (UTC)|text=OK. I'm glad you guys all blew this out of proportion.

*Anon 68.230.252.5: Due to past experience, our policy is to wait until official confirmation on voice actors, no matter how stupidly obvious it might be. Considering that it's only a matter of time until we '''''do''''' get confirmation, there's no point in saying that the voice actor "is" Ben Diskin. As for the link, probably {{w|Ben Diskin|Wikipedia}} would have been a better choice, since IMDB is basically dead to us, but there was no way for you to know that.
*Anon 198.209.0.252: You're not exactly one for professionalism or rational argument yourself, so please don't make this more than it already is. Also, if you're going to criticize our content, you can't do it on such a tenuous topic as unconfirmed VAs.
*Everybody: Stop flying off the handle so easily. I know we have trouble with anons, but you need to calm the crap down and be. rational. It is not necessary to go all out at the slightest thing.

If anyone want to continue this, and that'd better not be ANY of you, take it elsewhere.}}

Here's your 130% confirmation: http://i.imgur.com/dqneB.png  We also get a clarification of David's role in everything too.  And guess what...  ''I won't make any edits.''  You guys do it.  But if I don't see any edits in the next 12 hours...  Let's just say your already dubious validity won't even be questioned - there won't be a ''need'' for questioning.  --[[Special:Contributions/68.230.252.5|68.230.252.5]] 06:42, 23 May 2012 (UTC)
::Thanks for the source! This clears up a question someone was having about David Gallagher, too.
::On a side note, can we please ''not'' encourage the voice actors to risk getting fired, especially when we can almost always just wait a month or two for more ethical ways to get the info? This really isn't critical info, guys.[[Special:Contributions/192.249.47.177|192.249.47.177]] 13:27, 23 May 2012 (UTC)
:::Yeah, I gave up after Vaan's seiyu for Duodecim was replaced after he let loose the pigeons. You're pretty much asking for Square to put David back in, anon. [[User:Maggosh|mag]][[User talk:Maggosh|gosh]] 15:58, 23 May 2012 (UTC)
:::Yeah...  Just to clarify lol, I had nothing to do with the guy being bothered - just caught that pic on the boards.  After reading through a bit more, I do feel pretty bad for him.  We have the dumbest, most obnoxious fanbase around.  =_= --[[Special:Contributions/68.230.252.5|68.230.252.5]] 16:50, 23 May 2012 (UTC)

== Wrong info ==
We state here that after failing to induct Sora, Young Xehanort returns to his own time and gives up his memories of Dream Drop Distance and the grows up to be Master Xehanort. This cannot happen as Young Xehanort is a member of the Thirteen Darkness and is he were to lose his memories and leave, they would only have eleven members.
:I haven't completely understood KH time travel yet but consider this: Xemnas, Ansem, Xigbar und Saix were already defeated and can still attend the meeting (because they were brought there through time). Also if Xehanort just needs 13 versions of himself, why doesn't he just bring 12 younger selfs? --[[User:ShardofTruth|ShardofTruth]] 13:41, 26 May 2012 (UTC)
::Because Nomura wants to bring all the Xehanorts back.
:Except he LITERALLY says he'll return to his own time and will lose his memories of what happened. [[User:Maggosh|mag]][[User talk:Maggosh|gosh]] 16:23, 26 May 2012 (UTC)
::Yes but that means that there cannot be a new Organization XIII.--[[Special:Contributions/124.168.242.102|124.168.242.102]] 01:27, 27 May 2012 (UTC)

==Unmerge?==
{{LightRoxas|axel=Seriously, I think the merging of Master and Young Xehanort's articles was a bad plan. The article is quite hard to follow, what with the different timelines. Xehanort's story begins at with the events of BbS, ''not'' with the events described in KH3D - those take place in an alternate timeline of sorts. At this point, I honestly can't follow the article at all, and I certainly think it worked better as two separate articles. In addition, having the article be named Xehanort only adds to the confusion we were trying so hard to avoid with Terra-Xehanort.}}
:False. It's not an alternate timeline, it's just one guy looping forward then going back. He's the same guy, and the character and the voice actors (out of canon) have confirmed that it's the same character.{{User:KrytenKoro/Sig}} 05:01, 28 May 2012 (UTC)
::And yet, the characters are treated as separate entities. - [[Special:Contributions/50.133.206.189|50.133.206.189]] 14:43, 28 May 2012 (UTC)
:::Well, yeah, it's one guy, just occupying two different points in space. {{User:Chitalian8/Sig}} 15:03, 28 May 2012 (UTC)
::::I honestly agree with LightRoxas. You have know idea who the hell the article's about. Is it Apprentice Xehanort? Master Xehanort? Young Xehanort? You can't tell until you click. Really not good for some of the editors/readers. And is it just me, or does the page seem a bit cluttered/chaotic with all of Young Xehanort's information added to it? - [[Special:Contributions/24.63.239.203|24.63.239.203]] 04:50, 1 June 2012 (UTC)
:::::Young Xehanort and Master Xehanort are the ''same person''. If you're confused about the time travel, or who Xehanort is, talk to Nomura about that. That's why we have a disambig at the top, and explain the intent of the article in the lead paragraph. Beyond that, there's not much we can do to reasonably accommodate the series' soap opera-level lunacy.{{User:KrytenKoro/Sig}} 06:09, 1 June 2012 (UTC)
::::::There are going to be a total of thirteen different Xehanorts from various points in his timeline in the [[True Organization XIII]], and the six we've been introduced to thus far are very different. We have separate articles for all of them but these two, even though Young Xehanort has been treated as a separate entity from Master Xehanort both in scenes and in the KH3D Reports profiles. In his report profile, instead of being an alternate character model for Master Xehanort like Young Sora is for Sora, Young Xehanort gets his very own profile, as do the other four True Organization XIII members, despite the fact that they're all essentially the same guy. As we get more and more Xehanorts, this article is bound to get extremely convoluted, especially if we keep in the perspective of Sora's chronology. I propose we make "Xehanort" the article that tells the story of each iteration of Xehanort in one timeline based on Xehanort's chronology, not Sora's or the player's, categorized by each of his thirteen forms. But also give each of the thirteen members their own article with information on what that particular version of Xehanort does, how that particular version of Xehanort behaves, who that particular version of Xehanort meets, etc. "Young Xehanort" is extremely different from "Master Xehanort," because YX is destined to be all of the other Xehanorts before he is MX.

::::::It's like the various incarnations of the Doctor in Doctor Who, if you're at all familiar with that series. They're all the same person, but they all have different quirks, mannerisms, and personalities. If you say "the Doctor," a fan will assume you're talking about his current iteration. You have to specify which Doctor you're talking about. The First Doctor and the Eleventh Doctor are very different men, and yet both are the same man. Same goes for Young Xehanort and Master Xehanort. [[User:Fabala011|Fabala011]] ([[User talk:Fabala011|talk]]) 23:21, 2 August 2012 (UTC)


I feel like you haven't watched doctor who, then,as it explicitly describes the process as "dying, but becoming someone else", not "aging a bit". Xehanort to xemnas would be an apt comparison, not this.{{User:KrytenKoro/Sig}} 16:57, 8 May 2013 (UTC)

== Organization ==

It makes no sense to cover Young Xehanort's time travel escapades in the section covering the era before BbS.

#We cover the events from the PoV of an in-universe chronicler, NOT the character himself.
#We have absolutely no evidence for ''which order'' his time travel escapades happened in. Maybe he went to Land of Departure on his way back to his original time, we don't know. Maybe he did it during KH3D while waiting for Sora to show up at TWTNW.

It's imposing an unsupported narrative that doesn't jive with the "landmarks" we are using to provide context. It does not make sense in this order.{{User:KrytenKoro/Sig}} 05:04, 28 May 2012 (UTC)
: I agree, we should put it back in the BBS and DDD section, Ill do it if you give me the green light.--[[Special:Contributions/124.168.242.102|124.168.242.102]] 09:45, 28 May 2012 (UTC)
::(Young) Xehanort said for himself that time travel is only possible in one direction, so he visited the Land of Departure before waiting for Sora in The World That Never Was. I don't know how he returned though, there is still a lot to explain. --[[User:ShardofTruth|ShardofTruth]] 10:07, 1 June 2012 (UTC)
:::Hmmm....that definitely helps, and should be written to be implied by the article, then. However...since we don't have actual year numbers for this universe, it seems like the most effective way to make it clear when time travel escapades actually happen is to cover them from the universe's PoV, rather than Xehanort's...I don't know at this point. Can we prepare drafts of each version?{{User:KrytenKoro/Sig}} 15:12, 1 June 2012 (UTC)
{{LightRoxas|epic=Sorry to be late to this party; anyway, I can write up a draft from the universe's point of view, since I see that as less of a total mind-blower.}}
::Universe is what's already on the page, isn't it?[[Special:Contributions/192.249.47.177|192.249.47.177]] 19:30, 13 June 2012 (UTC)
:::You're right, I misread the article. Carry on. {{User:LightRoxas/Sig}} 20:12, 13 June 2012 (UTC)

== Confusing ==

To quote an immortal, gumball-loving time traveler who was formerly insane "Time Travel makes pronouns so confusing." Translation, we don't know how Time Travel works in the series, and no one say "Nomura is contradicting his own logic"(I've had enough of hearing that). Look, until the whole thing is explained a little better(like using smaller words), we should avoid saying things like "alternate timeline" even if it does turn out to be true. Just my opinion, cause I'm confused enough as it is. [[Special:Contributions/97.81.35.41|97.81.35.41]] 14:33, 7 May 2013 (UTC) Rex Ronald Rilander
:We're...not using that term here...read the article next time. [[User:Maggosh|mag]][[User talk:Maggosh|gosh]] 19:44, 7 May 2013 (UTC)
:*sighs* I mean that the Young Xehanort and the Master Xehanort should be considered two different people for the time being, even if they're the same person. One is the current version and one is from the past(who also barely refers to himself as Xehanort(he only does it, like, once)). And whether or not the young one is from an alternate timeline or not, he needs his own page. Still just my opinion though. [[Special:Contributions/97.81.35.41|97.81.35.41]] 21:22, 7 May 2013 (UTC) Rex Ronald Rilander
::They're the same person. There are no alternate timelines involved. End of story. [[User:Maggosh|mag]][[User talk:Maggosh|gosh]] 21:27, 7 May 2013 (UTC)
:::It's queries like this which is why I put a Time Travel page on the agenda for the Friday roundtable. Hopefully if that page is made, it will clear confusion on this page. {{User:TheFifteenthMember/Sig1}} 21:33, 7 May 2013 (UTC)
If they're the same person then why do they have different journal entries? The answer is because they are treated as two different characters for the sake of sparing confusion. Which is not what is happening here. [[Special:Contributions/97.81.35.41|97.81.35.41]] 21:43, 7 May 2013 (UTC) Rex Ronald Rilander
:I disagree, BBS uses two different journal entries for Vanitas, it's more about game progression than it's about sparing confusion. {{User:ShardofTruth/Sig}} 22:43, 7 May 2013 (UTC)
Really? Well, I've never played BBS so I really wouldn't know. Sorry, my mistake. But I still think it would be better to have two pages for them, for the younger and easily confused fans. I'm just trying to help is all. [[Special:Contributions/97.81.35.41|97.81.35.41]] 00:17, 8 May 2013 (UTC) Rex Ronald Rilander
:So we should have separate pages for KH1 and KH2 Riku too, right? He looks totally different and has a different personality and everything, there's no way that won't confuse people.{{User:KrytenKoro/Sig}} 01:34, 8 May 2013 (UTC)
::But those two don't show up in the same game, do they? [[User:TheSilentHero|TheSilentHero]] ([[User talk:TheSilentHero|talk]]) 07:23, 8 May 2013 (UTC)
The Hero has a point. But we saw Riku grow into his KHII self, from CoM to Days to II, but YX is from a large gap in time which we have not witnessed. We haven't seen YX gradually grow into MX, but we saw KH Riku gradually grow into KHII Riku. Anyways, I'm done here, I still think it would be better to split the pages. So just put it to a vote or something, I have more important things that require my attention. [[Special:Contributions/97.81.35.41|97.81.35.41]] 14:16, 8 May 2013 (UTC) Rex Ronald Rilander
:kh1 riku does, in fact, show up in khii, just not in person. We also have that instance in kh3d. Nevertheless, its still a silly suggestion: its literally the same exact person at different ages. As much "growth" as even needed to be depicted ''was''...xehanort didn't change his personality much, if at all. Ansem the king, for example, changes more over the course of khii than xehanort ever did.{{User:KrytenKoro/Sig}} 16:53, 8 May 2013 (UTC)
::Something I will settle for, is maybe dividing the Kingdom Hearts 3D sub-section, under 'Story', into two more sections: Young Xehanort and Master Xehanort. Even still, I find ''that'' unnecessary. {{User:TheFifteenthMember/Sig1}} 17:06, 8 May 2013 (UTC)

== Separate Xehanorts on Pages ==

{{KeybladeSpyMaster|time=16:44, 31 March 2014 (UTC)|text=So, I know this links back to previous arguments about unmerging Xehanort and whatnot, but here goes. My question is about the other articles. This article treats Master Xehanort and Young Xehanort as the same person. Shouldn't the other articles do this? For example, the article for [[The World That Never Was]] lists the two separate Xehanorts. If we're going to treat them as one and the same being, should we not remove the separate links on the other pages and simply link once to this page with the name "Xehanort" rather than twice with the names "Master Xehanort" and "Young Xehanort"? }}
Well, the game refers to them as such, and they are legitimately different beings in the game itself. However, wiki-wise, and in reality, they are the same person, just different forms. So, to stay in the same frame as the game, it's better to refer to each as one separate being, than one person. It would not flow well, if let's say, we said "Xehanort fought Riku by possessing Xehanort" for example. However, if we're talking about the list of characters/bosses, it's a similar situation to Flora, Fauna and Merryweather. All 3 links link to the same page, but they're different beings. {{User:Erry/Sig}} 22:25, 31 March 2014 (UTC)

== Xemnas ==

It says on the page that Xemnas is Xehanort's nobody. That's not strictly true, he's Terra's nobody influenced by Xehanort. {{User:LightningPrincess12}} 13:57, September 22 2014

You're misinterpreting. It's not talking about Master Xehanort, it's talking about Terra-Xehanort. Allow me to show you: "Through his(Master Xehanort) many different incarnations, including Terra-Xehanort, his(Terra-Xehanort) Heartless, Ansem, Seeker of Darkness, and his(Terra-Xehanort) Nobody, Xemnas,". Like that. [[Special:Contributions/97.81.38.40|97.81.38.40]] 14:07, 22 September 2014 (UTC) Rex Ronald Rilander

:Don't forget, in "[[Signs of What's Next]]", Master Yen Sid implies that Xemnas and Ansem are Master Xehanort's Nobody and Heartless, respectively. "Xehanort's heart, once seized by his Heartless half, is now free, and his body, which had become his Nobody, has been vanquished. Both halves will now be returned to the whole. In short, this means Master Xehanort will return." If Xemnas wasn't Xehanort's Nobody, and Ansem, Xehanort's Heartless, then they would return to become Terra-Xehanort, not Master Xehanort. {{KeybladeSpyMaster/Sig}} 14:46, 22 September 2014 (UTC)

:Yeah but, then what happens to Terra? But since Ansem, Seeker of Darkness and Xemnas use Time Travel to join Master Xehanort in 3D, maybe it causes some type of backlash that prevents Terra from returning? Ugh, this version of Time Travel is so confusing to my brain, I hope someone can explain it better, whether in KHIII or on the wiki. [[Special:Contributions/97.81.38.40|97.81.38.40]] 14:59, 22 September 2014 (UTC) Rex Ronald Rilander

:Terra is still Terra-Xehanort, as we've come to call him, and he's a part of the Organization. Xehanort implies this in ''Kingdom Hearts 3D: Dream Drop Distance'', when he says that "Sora and another on your list belong to me." Terra is within the ranks of the new Organization, most likely as a time-displaced Terra-Xehanort. As I understand it, everyone in the Organization is now time-displaced, with the exception of Master Xehanort, who's returned to the present time. I'm not sure of Saïx, because Lea calls him "Isa", but Xigbar isn't his original self, so...that I don't know about. {{KeybladeSpyMaster/Sig}} 15:08, 22 September 2014 (UTC)

:They really didn't make it too clear to follow, did they? While I'm sure they tried their best to explain it, it just didn't happen. Thanks though for telling me your take on it, and about Terra-Xehanort being a member of the new Organization, that makes a lot of sense, so thanks again. [[Special:Contributions/97.81.38.40|97.81.38.40]] 15:13, 22 September 2014 (UTC) Rex Ronald Rilander

I got the impression that MX was talking about Xemnas when he mentioned Terra belonging to him, and one thing I Don't get is Why did Xemnas's destruction effect MX since how Xemnas was made from Terra's body and soul?{{User:LightningPrincess12}} 14:15, January 5 2015


== Fragmentary Passage ==
Why is this considered non-canon? [[User:Diamonddeath|Diamonddeath]] ([[User talk:Diamonddeath|talk]]) 08:25, 10 December 2014 (UTC)
:The game announced by "A Fragmentary Passage" is not in production or creation, or any form of development. While the idea/concept is still being considered, because of the likelihood that the entire idea could be abandoned, the wiki doesn't consider it canon. There really isn't anything in the video to consider canon, anyways; it's a ton of scenes that don't seem related to each other. {{KeybladeSpyMaster/Sig}} 17:00, 10 December 2014 (UTC)

==The passing of Chikao Ohtsuka==
{{TNE|time=13:44, 17 January 2015 (UTC)|sadtext=It seems KHInsider has released news that Chikao Ohtsuka passed away at age 85. Ischaemic heart failure. RIP.

It'd be easy to talk about who is replacing the Japanese Master Xehanort, but at this point, I just can't.}}

{{RikutheBloody|time=13:46, 17 January 2015 (UTC)|sad=Sorry to ruin the moment, but there is a forum page. Check it out.}}
Cheers, I will do. '''[[User:Troisnyxetienne|<font color="dodgerblue">Trois</font>]][[User:Troisnyxetienne|<font color="darkslateblue">nyx</font>]]''' 13:49, 17 January 2015 (UTC)

== The passing of Leonard Nimoy ==

Leonary Nimoy has passed away on Feb. 27, 2015. RIP.  --{{User:Neumannz/SigTemplate}} 18:02, 27 February 2015 (UTC)
:Yes, it's a very sad day today. Is there anything we can/should do about it? Like something to commemorate his life and work on the series? {{KeybladeSpyMaster/Sig}} 18:24, 27 February 2015 (UTC)
::Oh, God... I can't believe it. May he rest in peace.--{{User:NinjaSheik/Sig}} 02:29, 28 February 2015 (UTC)

== Age of Xehanort ==

Since we don't get exact numbers on Xehanort, I'm thinking there should be different names for him in different times to differentiate between the forms and for image naming purposes.

*Terra-Xehanort - Apprentice of Ansem - Nobody/Heartless Split.
*Master Xehanort - During Events of BBS/Old Goat in KH3D
*Young Xehanort - Time Travelling jerk in KH3D/BBS
*Child Xehanort - Playing Chess with CE in E3 2015 trailer. (He seems significantly younger from his time-travelling age)
Thoughts? {{User:Chainoffire/sig}} 05:41, 26 June 2015 (UTC)
::Instead of Child, how about "Xehanort (Apprentice)"?{{User:KrytenKoro/Sig}} 13:16, 26 June 2015 (UTC)
:::Agreed with Kryten. He's more of a teenager in appearance. Everything else is fine. :)--{{User:NinjaSheik/Sig}} 19:34, 26 June 2015 (UTC)
::::How can be younger of DDD? He said he traveled in time BEFORE left the Destiny's Islands, so is impossible he was younger of DDD.
Sorry for my bag grammar, I'm italian.--[[Special:Contributions/189.39.241.193|189.39.241.193]] 20:30, 26 June 2015 (UTC)
:::::Some are assuming that he returned to Destiny Islands for whatever reason.{{User:KrytenKoro/Sig}} 00:54, 27 June 2015 (UTC)
:Kryten's idea sounds good to me. {{User:Chainoffire/sig}} 01:21, 27 June 2015 (UTC)
::But YX said he traveled in time BEFORE leaving Destiny's Island--[[Special:Contributions/189.39.241.193|189.39.241.193]] 01:36, 27 June 2015 (UTC)
:::When I think about, time traveling Xehanort and Xehanort as an apprentice does look roughly around the same age.--{{User:NinjaSheik/Sig}} 04:22, 27 June 2015 (UTC)
::::I agree with NinjaSheik. I personally don't think he looks younger at all. I think it's pointless to debate Young Xehanort's age right now. I mean, it could just be the new graphics that makes him look younger in the trailer to some people. [[User:Blackchaos27|Blackchaos27]] ([[User talk:Blackchaos27|talk]]) 05:25, 27 June 2015 (UTC)
::::::For all we know, Time Xexhanort and Apprentice Xehanort could be one and the same from the same time. I'm okay with waiting until more information is released, but for image naming purposes, either names can do and we move it later?--{{User:NinjaSheik/Sig}} 22:57, 27 June 2015 (UTC)
:::::::That's probably the best bet. {{User:Chainoffire/sig}} 06:38, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

== How does Young Xehanort time travel? ==
Don't you have to leave your body behind and just become a heart? --[[User:Elfdemon|Elfdemon]] ([[User talk:Elfdemon|talk]]) 05:38, 26 January 2016 (UTC) <br/>
EDIT: I know that Ansem, Seeker of Darkness gave Young Xehanort the ability to do this, but how did he give him this ability exactly? How do you just give someone the power to time travel? <br/>
Also, How did Ansem, Seeker of Darkness separate himself from his body and become just a heart so he can time travel without a Keyblade? Don't you need a Keyblade to separate your heart from your body? <br/>
--[[User:Elfdemon|Elfdemon]] ([[User talk:Elfdemon|talk]]) 07:28, 26 January 2016 (UTC)
:I believe that's simply how to unlock the ability for yourself, which Xehanort did eventually when he became Ansem, and as they(Ansem and YX) were versions of each other, Ansem was able to give YX the ability to Time Travel. How he did it ''exactly'', is not currently known in detail. Ansem didn't have a body, period. Mickey explicitly states this "Xehanort did give up his body. It was a version of him that was possessing Riku.". [[User:Rex Ronald Rilander|Rex Ronald Rilander]] ([[User talk:Rex Ronald Rilander|talk]]) 04:03, 28 January 2016 (UTC)

Okay, yeah that makes sense. I imagine that going back in time and making contact with that version of yourself would create some sort of anomaly where you're able to give and receive eachother's abilities and powers. Thanks for the response. --[[User:Elfdemon|Elfdemon]] ([[User talk:Elfdemon|talk]]) 06:07, 28 January 2016 (UTC)

No problem. If you ever have any questions, come see me. I know more about Kingdom Hearts than anyone else. [[User:Rex Ronald Rilander|Rex Ronald Rilander]] ([[User talk:Rex Ronald Rilander|talk]]) 21:53, 28 January 2016 (UTC)

== Future split? ==

With 2.8 releasing next month and KH3 coming out within the next few years, is it possible we will see a "Master Xehanort" and Young Xehanort" split. Will they ever have their own separate articles? I know they are the same person, but they both play different roles (sorta) and will likely have very different roles come KH3, considering Young Xehanort is one of the thirteen seekers of darkness. Also it would appear much more user friendly to split the articles. It's just an idea, though. I haven't been here long enough to see if there was a specific reasoning for this. [[User:Hallowseve97|Hallowseve97]] ([[User talk:Hallowseve97|talk]]) 23:37, 1 December 2016 (UTC)
:They actually ''were'' seperate at one point, back when Young Xehanort was first identified. However, though I didn't agree with the choice at the time, they were merged because they are in fact the same person. It's not like with Trunks and Future Trunks from ''Dragon Ball Z'' who lived completely different lives. Young and Master Xehanort have and will live the same life, in time. And as such should stay one article. [[User:Rex Ronald Rilander|Rex Ronald Rilander]] ([[User talk:Rex Ronald Rilander|talk]]) 04:12, 2 December 2016 (UTC)
::That's the main issue with it, yeah. If we split it, you'd have a Young Xehanort article, and then a comprehensive Master Xehanort article would still contain all the events covered in the Young Xehanort article, because that's his past. I suppose, depending on the physics of time travel, that we could argue the ''time-traveling'' Young Xehanort as a "different kind of being", but YX and MX definitely have the least amount of separation of any of the new Org -- where Ansem and Xemnas and the others clearly identify other members as distinct, YX and MX always talk about the other being "myself".{{User:KrytenKoro/Sig}} 13:59, 2 December 2016 (UTC)
:::What will we do, though, if the Young Xehanort betrays the Master? It has been hinted that YX is not evil, and is only going along with MX's plan because he believes it's his fate and there's nothing he can do about it. There are theories going around that YX will eventually betray MX, and since KHIII is basically about giving happy endings to all main chracters, and YX may end up being good, I believe in the end the Key to Return Hearts or whatever McGuffin will be used so that a piece of YX's heart can be transferred to a newly created body, allowing him to return to the past so there's no paradox AND simultaneously having a chance to live a life without becoming MX.
:::I mean, if YX turns out to be good, it would be too much of a sad ending to have a good character be forced to eventually become evil and having nothing they can do about it, and Nomura already promised a happy ending. So, if that happens, we'll probably have to split, right? {{User:G-SANtos/Sig}} 22:29, 2 December 2016 (UTC)
::::Uh..no. Since all that is just conjecture. [[User:Rex Ronald Rilander|Rex Ronald Rilander]] ([[User talk:Rex Ronald Rilander|talk]]) 06:50, 3 December 2016 (UTC)
:::::No, I'm not talking about splitting it now. I'm saying, when the game comes out, if something similar to what I said happens, will we have to split the pages after the fact, since, in that case, the two Xehanorts would be effectively different beings? {{User:G-SANtos/Sig}} 18:44, 3 December 2016 (UTC)
::::::Let's just wait until the game comes out before we start discussing the possibility of a split. {{User:TheSilentHero/Sig}} 18:46, 3 December 2016 (UTC)
:::::::Wiki policy is that a character's full history is covered on its page, and is only split if that person becomes a different entity, like how Terra-Xehanort became Ansem and Xemnas (similar to digivolving). Only way I can see Young being split from Master, ''per our current policy'', is if something like a split timeline version of a character happens (a la Andromeda or Red Dwarf). Even then, the current coverage (which is that Master Xehanort's history includes that of the current appearances of Young Xehanort) would still be valid, unless Nomura retcons that, somehow, Master Xehanort's "true" past was not what we were shown -- which would somewhat invalidate the entire plot of KH3D, but who even knows with him anymore.{{User:KrytenKoro/Sig}} 19:10, 5 December 2016 (UTC)

== Uggghhhh...split? ==

So, given the reveal in KH3 that Young Xehanort is Xehanort's heart within a Replica body, would that satisfy our criteria for being fundamentally different beings and require a split?<!--I hate Xehanort's plot, and all the mess it makes for an encyclopedia-->{{User:KrytenKoro/Sig}} 13:45, 22 February 2019 (UTC)
:There would definitely be benefits to splitting them just from an article perspective. Given that right now we have Young and Master Xehanort existing at the same time, following the timeline of the character is tough. If we were truly to cover the chronology as the character experiences it, we would have to cover Young Xehanort on Destiny Islands → Meeting the Robed Figure → Secret boss fight → Gathering versions of himself → YX scenes in DDD → YX scenes in KH3 → Chess scenes (assuming they are even literal and not metaphorical) → all of old Xehanort's life. 
:The game almost treats them as different entities. At the same time, they are the same person. It is a mess. I guess I vote to split it for clarity's sake, even though they are the same person; the game hasn't really shown that what YX experiences in the present has any effect on MX, anyway. {{User:LightRoxas/Sig}} 14:41, 22 February 2019 (UTC)
::While I was always for splitting the page, if we split based on the fact that YX is a heart in a replica body, that only counts for when he travels through time. So the scenes on DI, when he meets the Robed Figure, and the chess scenes are not from when he was a replica, so then that should be covered on the MX page, which would be confusing. A better way would be to split young and old, but since they're the same person (excluding time travel stuff), that would be against policy. {{User:TheSilentHero/Sig}} 14:54, 22 February 2019 (UTC)
:::See, the thing is that Master Xehanort's plot ''does'' reference stuff from his youth -- just not from his time travelling days. So I think we could write coherent articles that diverge at the moment Young Xenny traveled to the future.{{User:KrytenKoro/Sig}} 15:57, 22 February 2019 (UTC)
::::I'm game for that. Include what we see of YX on Destiny Islands on the MX page, but put all his endeavors in DDD and KH3 on a separate page. {{User:LightRoxas/Sig}} 16:04, 22 February 2019 (UTC)
:::::I'm all for splitting the pages, too, but isn't the Young Xehanort in ''KH3D'' the one from Destiny Islands? My understanding was the actual Xehanort incarnations were summoned in ''3D'', but they were returned to their own time (including YX), unable to return to the resurrected Master Xehanort's present. Then Master Xehanort recruited Even, who gave him replicas that could host the hearts of the other Norts from across time. Those hearts then merged with the improved replicas, becoming new people. The heart inside gave the replica its appearance, which is why Dark Riku turned blank after Repliku extracted his heart. TLDR; ''KH3D'' Norts are the bodies and hearts of the actual people, while ''KHIII'' Norts are hearts in replica bodies. How we handle a split depends on when the games say Vexen joined Master Xehanort to give him replicas. Reasoning: Even is clearly human (albeit unconscious) throughout ''KH3D''. - {{User:EternalNothingnessXIII/Sig}} 16:45, 22 February 2019 (UTC)
:::::::My understanding was that Vexen joined to give ''better'' replicas, but that they still had his original stock for use. In addition, doesn't Master Xehanort say in KH3D that they will all reconvene for the final battle? So they should be the same entities. It would be pretty nonsense for Nomura to say he knew who all the 12 at KH3D were, if they were just going to be replaced for KH3.{{User:KrytenKoro/Sig}} 17:07, 22 February 2019 (UTC)
::::::::I think it's possible the time traveled members in 3D are just hearts, without a replica body, and that that is the reason why they only have a short time before they had to go back. Same for YX in BBS. It's not possible that he's using a replica body there, since the replica program started with Vexen, and he was still Even at the time. {{User:TheSilentHero/Sig}} 17:22, 22 February 2019 (UTC)
::::::::There is also the point about the rules of time travel that they state multiple times. You can't travel through time with your body, only a heart can travel through time. Dark Riku even makes a point of saying that when Yen Sid sends Sora and Riku back in KH3D, it's breaking that rule and that the 13 darknesses still had to follow it and give up his heart. ("Unlike a certain wizard you know, I had to play by the rules to travel through time. Which meant leaving my body behind.") He then pretty much states flat out that any time travelers are hearts inside replicas ("They could come from anywhere, any when, just as long as he had the right vessels at hand to place their hearts in.")[[User:Sirlionel13|Sirlionel13]] ([[User talk:Sirlionel13|talk]]) 18:04, 22 February 2019 (UTC)
:::::::::I thought the "certain wizard you know" referred to Merlin. {{User:TheSilentHero/Sig}} 18:17, 22 February 2019 (UTC)
::::::::::Yhea, is Merlin, in KH2 is Merlin that allow to Sora, Donald and Goofy to travel in the past ignoring the rules, not Yen Sid.--[[Special:Contributions/93.150.192.173|93.150.192.173]] 18:26, 22 February 2019 (UTC)
::::::::::Yeah, Yen Sid's version still followed Xehanort's rules. They went back to when they were kids, and followed DI into the Realm of Sleep. Only Merlin has done back-to-the-future style time travel.{{User:KrytenKoro/Sig}} 18:34, 22 February 2019 (UTC)
:::::::::::I interpreted that as Yen Sid, since I doubt Dark Riku knew about the Timeless River sequence. Regardless of which wizard he means, though, he's still pretty clear that Org XIII had to give up their bodies to travel through time and had to use replicas in the future.[[User:Sirlionel13|Sirlionel13]] ([[User talk:Sirlionel13|talk]]) 18:42, 22 February 2019 (UTC)
:::::::Maybe the replicas are just to allow them to circumvent the "have to have a version of themselves at the other end" rule? Out-of-universe the obvious explanation is that Nomura hadn't decided to go with replicas until KH3. If he had just made Even be missing in 3D we'd be fine and this would all work (as much as KH lore does), but in current form so much is lacking explanation. Maybe if your heart travels to a period of time in which another version of yourself is present, you can use that version of yourself to establish a new temporary body? I don't know man, this stuff is wack. {{User:LightRoxas/Sig}} 18:44, 22 February 2019 (UTC)
::I suggest waiting for the Ultimania before doing anything drastic. - {{User:EternalNothingnessXIII/Sig}} 18:54, 22 February 2019 (UTC)
I agree with a split, would make the pages easier to read. --[[User:Vanitas|Vanitas]] ([[User talk:Vanitas|talk]]) 22:01, 28 February 2019 (UTC)
:Shall we go ahead with the split then? As far as I'm aware Ultimania has not added anything to this topic. --[[User:Vanitas|Vanitas]] ([[User talk:Vanitas|talk]]) 16:58, 9 March 2019 (UTC)