Editing Talk:Ansem, Seeker of Darkness

Would anyone be opposed to moving this?  "Xehanort's Heartless" is more what he ''is'' than one he's called.  Maybe what he calls himself, i.e. Ansem, Seeker of Darkness?  I'll go ahead and do it if no one objects over the next few days.  [[User:Scottch|Scottch]] 05:28, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
:I really think it should be called Xehanort's Heartless. Ansem may be a name he stole and uses, but it's not who he really is. It's what everyone in the game calls him, so why not here? [[User:DannyP|DannyP]] 18:01, 30 March 2007 (UTC)
::Didn't see your reply, so this is late...
::Anyway, it's definitely not the only thing he's called in the games, he's called that by a few characters even after it's been made clear who he is, especially at the end of the game.  Besides, it's also the name he takes, it just makes more sense to me to call him by a name than an "object description", for lack of a better phrase.  He's also called "Ansem" for a full two of the three games, and the first half of the last game (in the sparse times it's mentioned).  Although he was originally thought to be Ansem the Wise and that turned out to be untrue, it doesn't change the fact that he identified as "Ansem" still.  I guess it sort of comes down to "what's in a name", but I think the use of the name makes it his identity, even if it's based on a lie.  '''''[[User:Scottch|<span style="color:#00cccc">Scott</span>]][[User talk:Scottch|<span style="color:#ff9900">ch</span>]]''''' 21:04, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

Ansem, Seeker of Darkness was the name he chose, so that should be what the page is called. it shouldnt be what he is, Sora's page isnt called Kingdom Key weilder, thats what he is not who he is.  [[User:1a2b3c|1a2b3c]] 11:50, 30 May 2009 (UTC)

==Merger==
I have another question.  Couldn't we just merge this with the World of Chaos and Guardian?  After all, both sections are stubs, and both creatures are never seen without him. Thoughts?

:Good idea. It'd be a perfect fit for a battle technique kind of section. [[User:DannyP|DannyP]] 15:52, 27 March 2007 (UTC)

== abilites ==
sorry to bother the editors but I think there should be a section called abilites which lists all of "Ansems" named attacks. I know in kh he just grunted but every time he saves up 3 cards in chain of memories we see the name of the slate underneth.

sincerly luis

PS I also reckomend we do this with all other charectors but also file magic underneth abilites (only because very few charectors use spells) this should go with all charectors like tarzans healing herb ability (because it a heal)

 

That sounds like a very logical idea. I wouldn't mind doing that on various pages! Maybe even describe the attacks! Muhahahaha!

P.S. Your comments don't have to be letters.

P. S. S. Here, you sign using 4 tildes (~) [[User:96.28.108.27|96.28.108.27]] 23:56, 1 May 2008 (UTC)

P. S. S. S. You aren't bothering the editors.

P. S. S. S. S. Would you like me to do a grammer check on your comment? It would make editors flock to your comment more! I really want your suggestion to happen!

== This page contridicts itself! ==

This page can't seem to decide if Xehanort's Heartless looks human because of strong will or a warped Riku. I'm not sure whether to delete one of the theories, show that they're theories, or a third option. Any ideas? [[User:96.28.108.27|96.28.108.27]] 23:57, 1 May 2008 (UTC)
== Battles ==
{{oath|time=<small>[[User:Oath to Order|OtO]]</small><sup>[[user talk:Oath to Order|con]]</sup>[[User:Oath to Order/Top Ten|^_-]] 21:37, 18 June 2008 (UTC)|text=What to do? This is the character page. Where do I put the boss info? Separate? Apart?}}

{{Azul|text= [[Xehanort's Heartless (Boss)]]}}

== Billy Zane ==

Out of curiosity, I heard Billy Zane refused to return as Ansem in Kingdom Hearts 2.  Does anyone know why?
:Likely too busy. [[User:XienZo|XienZo]] 05:10, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

==Unsure about this statement==

It says "Xehanort's Heartless body is actually Riku's body. When he fully gained control of it he changed the body's appearance" But wouldn't this imply that Riku had lost his body and become a heartless, and thus would have a Nobody? But since the latter two are untrue, I don't see how Xehanort's Heartless could have been doing anything other than making his own form look like Riku's on Destiny Islands at the end of the game. Can someone explain?
{{Twoface13|It's true that Riku lost his '''Body''' but kept his heart. Therefore he does not have a nobody, nor is he a heartless. However as Xehanort's heartless uses his Riku's body, he could be considered Riku's nobody. But he's not. He uses Riku's body because it was drawn to the Darkness, and he lost his [[Xemnas|true body]]. Xehanort's Heartless already had a set figure, and Riku's body changed to his form.|}}

== Ruler ==

{{KrytenKoro|When, and of what, exactly?}}

{{TNE|text=I didn't put that category there. But come to think of it, wasn't he the one who usurped Ansem the Wise's leadership ? By banishing Ansem to the Realm of Nothingness, his Heartless became the ruler of what was then known as Hollow Bastion, whilst his Nobody took charge of The World that Never Was.}}

{{Flashpenny | He's the ruler of the End of the World, the final level that is in and of itself the Heartless HQ. It's all but outright said that's probably the King of Heartless or something like that. Also Trois, I'm pretty sure that when Ansem was at his biggest threat Maleficent was the ruler of Hollow Bastion, not Ansem.}}
{{TNE|time=03:06, 23 July 2009 (UTC)|blahtext=I was talking about immediately after Ansem the Wise was banished...... Of course Maleficent took over HB later but then, what's the essence of it ?}}

== Names - Unsure ==

Just looked at the Riku Replica page, and noticed it calling Xehanort's Heartless "Ansem." Is this because he wasn't known as Xehanort's Heartless at the time of CoM? I think it makes more sense calling him by his true name....[[User:EndlessOblivionKH|<font color="000000">'''Endless '''</font>]][[User talk:EndlessOblivionKH|<font color="555555">'''Oblivion'''</font>]]
:"Xehanort's Heartless" isn't a name, though, and "Ansem" belongs to him just as much as the Organization member's names belong to themselves. He was attempting to take someone's reputation, yes, but "Ansem" is still who the Heartless was.
:Plus, it's a rather large part of the plot, them not knowing who DiZ is yet and thinking the Heartless was Ansem, and it would be confusing to anyone who's not played KH2 yet.[[User:KrytenKoro|<small>Glorious</small>]] [[User_talk:KrytenKoro|<small>CHAOS!</small>]] 16:12, 14 July 2009 (UTC)
{{EO||talktext=I see how that makes sense...Thanks.}}

== Other forms ==

Well, his cloaked form is his true Heartless form, while his fancy silver-haired form is merely how he manipulates riku's body (perhaps that's what Riku will look like grown up?) So we should be clear on that in the article.

Also, we might want to have a section covering the guardian, though there's not really much to say beyond battle stuff. We should add as much non-battle info as we can, though.
{{EO|time=11:18, 16 July 2009 (UTC)|talktext=By Cloaked, do you mean the Organization Cloak or the cloak from KH1? And no, I don't think that he attained that form because of controlling Riku. Xehanort had hair similar to that, and so does Xemnas...Xemnas is closer in hair design to Xehanort because he is Xehanort's empty body given new life after the Xehanort's Heartless was born.It specifically says Xehanort retained his physical appearance as a Heartless and Nobody. That means the "fancy" silver-haired form IS his true form. He just wore the cloak from KH1 to disguise himself until the time was right. But I don't know... and since the Guardian is not truly counted as a Heartless, I say we merge it. And the Guardian is actually a part of Xehanort's Heartless...}}

==Battle Quotes==
*"''Come.''"
*"''Is that it?''"
*"''Kneel!''"
*"''You give up yet?''"
*"''Show me your power!''"
*"''Now witness true Power!''"
*"''Welcome Oblivion.''"
*"''Here it comes!''"
*"''Behold the power of Darkness!''"
*"''Open your heart to Darkness!''"


{{EO|time=15:03, 16 July 2009 (UTC)|happytext=Question to those who could answer. Why are these the only battle quotes on his page? These are technically Riku's... Shouldn't we instead use his quotes from End of the World? I understand he controlled Riku when he used these quotes, but we don't use the Dark Riku battle video on his page, so this doesn't make sense...}}

{{TNE|time=03:01, 23 July 2009 (UTC)|text=Well, let's see : the quotes from the actual Xehanort's Heartless I can think of are...

*"''Come, guardian!''"
*"''Submit!!''"
*"''Come, open your heart.''"
*"''Insolent.''"
*"''What do you hope to accomplish?''"
*"''Do not deny.''"
*"''My strength returns...''"
*"''The final darkness returns.''"

Correct me if I'm wrong, and use these quotes where you see fit.}}

== About His Name ==

{{Flashpenny | I'm just blue-skying here but I don't think Xehanort's Heartless is his correct name. Let's think about this for the first 2 games and most of the third it'd pretty much accurate that his name is Ansem, regardless of whether or not that was his original name. Let's think about it: Xigbar is really Braig's Nobody, DiZ is really Ansem the Wise's Disguise and Xemnas is really Xehanort's Nobody. Are any of them called that? No. Same basic concept.}}
{{TNE|time=02:59, 23 July 2009 (UTC)|blahtext=Well, they '''had''' to call him Xehanort's Heartless to distinguish him from Ansem the Wise, didn't they ? Let's just leave it be.}}
{{Flashpenny | Well I'm pretty sure me and most others can easily distinguish judging by what context we use it in (i.e. Ansem was the main villain in the first game) and also by adding "the Wise" to the end of the good Ansem's name.}}
{{TNE|time=14:06, 23 July 2009 (UTC)|text=Remember the Japanese-speakers. Ansem's name is in katakana. Kenja = the wise, is in kanji. If they were to make a remark about the "wise" Xehanort's Heartless, they'd end up using the same thing. And the same change was brought about in other versions. I personally have no problem with ''Sans-cœur de Xehanort'' (Xehanort's Heartless) rather than having to call him Ansem again... see ?}}

== Help! ==

It's me, Mar1. I tried to copy paste the old Guardian on this page, but it's all messed up! Somone please help!
{{Xion4ever|time=18:38, September 13, 2009 (UTC)|text= Theres already a picture of the Guardian on here..What old Guardian photo are you talking about?}}

Never mind, it's under control.

== Why ==

Why the f**k does everyone keep the deleting the guardian section?!

Why?!

{{XNX|text=Mainly because there is absolutely no reason for the Guardian to have its own section, as most if not all of the attacks are made by the Guardian, wich will lead to it being mentioned numorous other times thoughout the article. Not to mention the fact that the "''Xehanort's Heartless's Guardian''" section was a short, puny group of sentences that had little information and didn't need its own section. That's why the f**k we keep deleteing it.}}

I just think the Guardian should get it's own page back.

{{KrytenKoro|
Because the edit was absolute trash.
#The story bit was completely redundant to the story covering when Riku took Xehanort's form.
#The "speculation" was not only completely ridiculous, but the links all pointed in the wrong directions.
#The edit ripped up a ref note.
#The rest of it is all battle strategy info, which is covered on the boss page.

Finally, "Guardian" is not its name. "Guardian" is a Surveillance-type Heartless. The only thing we know about Ansem's guardian is that it always appears with him, even when it's actually Riku. Thus, there's no reason to believe it's not simply the Pureblood part of Xehanort's Heartless.}}

y'know,, you don't have to be dicks about it, guys.

{{NinjaSheik|angry=Hey! Watch your mouth! Don't speak to Kryten-sama like that!}}

{{Ghostboy3000|text= OMG THAT WAS MEAN! ALL BECAUSE OF A STUPID SECTION! YEAH DON"T SPEAK LIKE THAT D:<}}

Kryten... Sama? Huh??

Hey, I just want to make this Wiki better!

{{NinjaSheik|angry=Well, there's no reason for you to say that about Kryten-sama! He's a good person!}}

:Why are you calling people dicks when you started this argument with a random swear...?—[[User:Urutapu|Urutapu]] 23:51, September 15, 2009 (UTC)

I was just frusterated because everyone kept deleting the guardian area, after it took five minutes just TO FREAKIN' COPY-PASTE!

{{NinjaSheik|angry=Calm down. I get frusterated because of the edit conflicts, but you don't see me yelling at someone when that happens. And who's delating it? Kryten-sama?}}

Why do you keep adding on "Sama"? I digress. I just felt That Ansem's Guardian need some of his own recognition.

And I don't know who's deleting it.

{{NinjaSheik|angry=I add "Sama" to the end of Kryten-sama's name because I respect him highly for the work he have done here on the wiki.

You don't know who delate it? Look at the History, then.}}

It was Kryten! And he said it was trash!

{{NinjaSheik|angry=That still doesn't give the right to call Kryten=sama the "D" word! He's a staff member! He knows what's best!}}
{{Firaga44|angry=yeah i agree!you can't just go around calling people that!}}

He may have been here longer than I have, but C'mon? Give a kid a break?!

{{XNX|text=@anon:Don't call anyone means names and solve thing civally. There are easier ways to solve problems without swearing, name-calling, and blaming.

@NinjaSheik, Firaga, GB:The anon does not need to be bullied back in gang form. Kryten is a big boy and I'm sure he would have said something on his own if he felt it necessary.}}

{{Xion4ever|time=00:18, September 16, 2009 (UTC)|text= Let's drop this shall we? We're just spamming up the wiki and bashing Mar. Mar (''please'' sign with the sig button or use your talkbubble), your reaction was unnecessary and wrong. 

Let's live it at that; Yes, what Mar did was wrong, that section will be/is deleted, and Kryten was right. No wiki fights please!}}

That's fine. I'm sorry, I usually just ;ash out at others when they lash out at me. After a long day of being bullied at school, I just have a whole bunch of anger boiling inside me. It's just kind of hard to contain myself. Mar1 00:25, September 16, 2009 (UTC)

Hello? Anybody? Mar 00:41, September 16, 2009 (UTC)

{{KrytenKoro|If the anon is going to cuss, then I feel perfectly justified in being frank about the lousiness of the edit. I re-added as much information as could be salvaged - most of it was, as I explained, trash. The guardian does not need specifically separate coverage, as it is simply an extension of the rest of Xehanort's Heartless, as the article covers.

I'm a staff member. Not a god. Please stop calling me "sama".

If you're frustrated about your work being deleted, don't put it on a wiki, or at least, back it up. I have ten years of notes and fan-documents on my PC, and only a small fraction of them are ported to wikis. As the editing notice says "If you don't want your writing to be edited mercilessly and redistributed at will, then don't submit it here."}}
{{Firaga44|text=yeah those are the rules and i have to apoligize for the outburst by me}}

Shouldn't there be warnings for the spoilers? If someone new to the game read even some of the article, sure he's/she's confused and reads just more?

Just suggesting.
:After a certain point, it becomes ridiculous to concede to spoiler warnings - for example, everyone knows how King Kong or the Sixth Sense ends, it would be strange for us to have spoiler warnings on articles like that.
:Currently, only information on Days, Mobile, coded, and BBS has spoiler warnings, as they are new/have not been released.[[User:KrytenKoro|<small>Glorious</small>]] [[User_talk:KrytenKoro|<small>CHAOS!</small>]] 17:02, November 14, 2009 (UTC)