Editing Forum:Gray VS Grey

{{Forumheader|The World that Never was}}
<!-- Please put your content under this line.  Be sure to sign your edits with either your talk page template or four tildes ~~~~ -->

{{LapisScarab|time=04:41, August 3, 2010 (UTC)|inverse=Okay, I know for a fact that both "gray" and "grey" are acceptable spellings of the color. However, this reminds me of the "s' VS s's" thing, where we decided one was going to be used for the standard on the wiki for consistency, yes? I've always spelled it "grey", but I see people changing it to the alternative one. Which one should the standard be?}}
{{SilverCrono|time=04:47, August 3, 2010 (UTC)|text=Well, in the color codes, you only get the color if you type "gray". and not "grey". I believe it has something to do with keeping a difference between British spelling, or something. :/}}
{{Auror Andrachome|text=I see "gray" across the wiki and I usually replace it with "grey" or I do the reverse of that for some weird reason. I went on wikipedia but I didn't get much from that. Can we have official reading if "gray" or "grey" is used in the game?}}
{{LapisScarab|time=04:51, August 3, 2010 (UTC)|text=[[The World That Never Was#The Grey Area|The Grey Area]].}}
According to days, it's grey, which I got from "The grey area". So 'e', not 'a'. I just checked the game itself. {{KKDSig|1}}
{{LapisScarab|time=20:47, August 3, 2010 (UTC)|text=So we're going with the "grey" spelling then? Unless anyone has any objections, I'll be changing it where I see it.}}
{{TNE|time=13:09, August 9, 2010 (UTC)|text=Okay, now the new concern I wanna bring up is the MOS v the actual spelling used in the games. The "Grey Area" versus American English normal spelling.

Now, this follows a recent revert of Pea's edits which changes all instances of "grey" to "gray".

Keep in mind that I'm not lashing out against anyone, just that where in-game spellings are provided, they must be followed. I admit I make that mistake myself too, sometimes, but we're all bound by it anyway. :P}}
{{KrytenKoro|Also, [[Grey Caprice]]. However (and this is just putting the option out there, not my opinion, since I hate the word "gray"), just because the game's set up a certain lexicon doesn't mean we can only use it. For example, "hunny" or "munny". If you guys want to go with grey, there are definitely arguments for and against that, but you shouldn't feel like the games' choices are limiting your decision.}}
{{LA|Vtext=<big>Gr'''<big>E</big>'''y = '''<big>E</big>'''ngland

Gr'''<big>A</big>'''y = '''<big>A</big>'''merica</big>

LevL told me that we're using "grey" as opposed to "gray" because that is how it is used in game. Uh... so what? It shouldn't matter what kind of spelling the game uses. Here, we are a source of information, an encyclopedia, that says in our editing instructions to use American english. Just because there is an in-game usage of a word does not mean we should convert or preachings on American English. Also, if there are any other in-game uses of the word "grey" besides a '''title or name''', one of the only exceptions to "grey", gladly give them to me, becqause I can't think of any other instances.

And you might want to consider a typo on the translator's part. The famous "Whirldwind to the Void" in Re:CoM is more than enough proof that it can happen. Sooooo, we'd be basing our editing structure off of a typo.

Also, on my computer, "grey" is not recognized in the computer's spell-check dictionary.}}
{{LapisScarab|time=21:21, August 12, 2010 (UTC)|text=I can tell you right off that it's not a typo, because "grey" ''is'' an acceptable spelling of the color. "Whirldwind" is clearly a typo because it's simply not spelled that way. "Grey" doesn't come up under my computer's spell-check, but I don't see why that would matter. Can you give any instance of the "gray" spelling being used in the series?}}
{{LA|Vtext=Just read Kryten's post. I agree completely.

Just because "gray" isn't used in the series and "grey" is, I don't think we should make an exception for the American English rule. That's how we work, right? Policies, rah rah rah.}}
{{LapisScarab|time=21:32, August 12, 2010 (UTC)|text="Grey" is also used in some American English names, greyhound for example (least according to Wikipedia). This isn't he same as the difference between "hunny" and "honey", since "hunny" is an actual misspelling of the word. "Grey" and "gray" are just alternative spellings, both of which are correct (again, like the s' VS s's thing). "Grey" is used in the US, just less than "gray". However, the "grey" spelling is used at least twice twice in the American edition of Days.}}

No, no, and no. Can we just agree that both grey and gray are acceptable means? If you see "grey", you can change it to "gray" or vice versa, okay? Lego, you just decided to start something that wasn't really needed, and I don't mean to pick sides, but.........

<big><big><big>KrytenKoro</big></big></big>, aren't you always saying something about always getting confirmtion from the game or a reliable website? Thats kinda the same thing here, Lapis confirmed that grey is used in the game, so yes, <big><big>We are going to use grey!!!</big></big>

Well, can we have a vote if we should use "grey" or "gray"? {{AurorSig}}
{{LA|Vtext=Can I get one thing straight? Is this Forum to change the names of "Grey Room" and "Grey Caprice"? Because that's ridiculous. THose titles are official. What I'm talking about is the wiki's apparent "American English grammar usage". If we are truly using American English, then this should be no discussion. We should use "gray", and change "grey" when we see it. I'm trying to say that it doesn't matter how many times "grey" is used in-game. We are an online encyclopedia that uses a set form of grammar, American English, and the spelling "gray" is the correct form in this grammar system. Using "grey" in everything except for "Grey Caprice" and "The Gray Room" is incorrect, and I'm going to change it if I see it around.

Auror, I was just going around finding things to edit. Do not point fingers. I have seen in the past that the admins like DTN change "grey" to "gray", and I was trying to follow through with that. Don't start at me because I was trying to be a little responsible and hold up our policies.}}

{{LapisScarab|time=22:13, August 12, 2010 (UTC)|text=Who said anything about changing those names? What I'm saying is that they're ''both'' acceptable American English spellings of the color, and the "grey" spelling is the only one used in the American edition of the series. And Auror, "vice versa" isn't what I'm going for here. There really should be a standard so the writing on the articles in consistent. We should use one spelling or the other.}}
{{LA|Vtext=If we're doing one spelling or the other, I think we should leave Grey Caprice and Grey Room as is, and change everything else to "gray". American English. Policies. Seriously.}}
{{LapisScarab|time=22:41, August 12, 2010 (UTC)|text=Exactly, they're ''both'' acceptable American English spellings, except one has actually been used in-game and the other hasn't. Seriously.}}

So, have we made a decision, seriously? {{AurorSig}}
{{LA|Vtext=It hasn't been used in game. Those names are '''proper nouns''' and '''titles''', some exceptions to the usage of "grey". Please give me an example of the use of the word "grey" as a COLOR, stated in the game. We're discussing what to use to define the color on, not the title, on the wiki. This, due to our policy, would make "gray" the correct spelling.}}
{{LapisScarab|Time=22:56, August 12, 2010 (UTC)|text=The Grey Caprice's name is a direct reference to its grey coloration. Please give ''me'' an example of the use of the word "gray" as a color in-game.}}
{{LA|Vtext=I meant a character saying something like:

"That Grey Caprice is grey"

I've said time and again that titles, such as the name of an enemy, are an exception to "grey". What I meant before was a CHARACTER specifically saying the word in direct use of the adjective, describing something as the color gray, using "grey". And even if you did find it, it still would matter. I've also said time and again that it does not matter what the game would use. It is a POLICY that WE use "gray", not "grey". This was decided when we chose the American English policy.

This is exactly like the "apostrophe-s" discussion. It ended with the verdict, "American English". I don't understand why you're so against that.}}
{{LapisScarab|time=23:07, August 12, 2010 (UTC)|text=It is still being used to describe the color of the Grey Caprice. As ''I've'' said time and time and again, '''''both spellings''''' are acceptable American English. If you can provide even one instance of "gray" being used in the games, I'll go with that, since I know the "gray" spelling is more common. The fact is, I've provided two instances of "grey"--which, I repeat, is an acceptable spelling of the word--being used in the series.}}
{{LA|Vtext=I don't need an in-game example. We use American English. Wiki policy overrules what the game uses in a title, and it is my backup. And it is all I need. We use Grey in name, and gray in color.<!--To quote Redeemer from the IRC-->

Also, Wikipedia states that "Gray" is the correct form, not "grey". However, they are both used commonly in names.}}
{{LapisScarab|time=23:20, August 12, 2010 (UTC)|text=I just checked Webster's dictionary (more credible than Wikipedia, yes?), and both spellings are in it. "Grey" is listed as a variant of "gray", which I already pointed out; I know "gray" is the more commonly used spelling in the US, but ''both'' are correct. Like I said, if "gray" was used even once in the games, I'd be with you, '''but it isn't'''. "Grey" is used not just once, but twice in the American games. "Gray" isn't used even a single time from what I can tell. Burden of proof goes to you.}}
Ugh. OK, can anybody think of a moment where it might have come up in any of the games, besides in proper nouns, so we can check the spelling?  --<span style="font-size:10pt">[[User:Neumannz|'''<span style="font-size=12pt; font-family:Gisha; color:#005400">Neumannz</span>''']], [[User talk:Neumannz|''<span style="color:black; font-family:Agency FB Bold">The Dark Falcon</span>'']]</span> 23:31, August 12, 2010 (UTC)
{{LA|Vtext=Two things.

First, please stop bringing up the games. The spelling used in the game doesn't matter at all. We're a site that allows access to information on the Kingdom Hearts series that uses American English as the basis of grammar. Using the way people talk in the games would be something like the structure of [[Card:Main Page|this page]], and, if used on all of our articles, would sound unprofessional. Forget what the game uses. It's like adding "Fella" or "a-hyuk" all over Mickey and Goofy's respective pages. Our priority is American English before the games.

Second. This is more of an argument between the two of us that is behaving similarly to an edit war. Neither of us are going to win. I suggest either we wait for other responses, or we just drop this, and go back to the way it was before you brought it up. Really now, we're fighting over a color. We should give it a rest.}}
{{EO|time=23:39, August 12, 2010 (UTC)|text=If a certain spelling is used as part of the subject's name, then it should be spelled as such only to refer to the subject, an example being the Grey Caprice. In terms of describing the subject, if it is gray, then we should use the "a" spelling. So the sentence would formulate like so:
*''"The GREY Caprice is a GRAY Heartless."''}}
{{LapisScarab|time=23:41, August 12, 2010 (UTC)|text=The spelling in the games matters when, for the umpteenth time, both spellings of the word are correct in American English. What part of that aren't you grasping? You haven't provided a single source to back up your statements outside of Wikipedia. But I digress, fine, let's some others give some input.}}

{{The Inexistent|text='''Does it bloody matter?  Who said we have to user American English?  Like half the editors here aren't American, so does it matter?'''}}
{{TNE|time=00:40, August 13, 2010 (UTC)|attntext=Thing about the American spelling is when I first suggested a remodel of the [[Manual of Style]], it did say "The language of the wiki is English", but for consistency's sake, we needed to go with a standard. And most of us (including the BrE-speaking people) actually said that American English is the way to go, considering the gameplay is in American English, even for the British release (the spellings are never modified). Now if this were to happen (and it already has), consider that the in-game spellings hold precedence over whatever other spellings go. It's like how we once called "Identity Disk" the "Identity Dis''c''", but switched it to Disk because it was the in-game spelling.}}
{{LA|Vtext=Inexistent: It states so in the [[Kingdom Hearts Wiki:Manual of Style|Manual of Style]].}}

Well, we're definitely not changing any names, whatever we choose. Since neither "grey" nor "gray" appears outside of the two names, (correct me if I'm wrong on that,) it is really up to us which one we use for other cases. And in that case, we should follow the MoS. I say "gray".  --<span style="font-size:10pt">[[User:Neumannz|'''<span style="font-size=12pt; font-family:Gisha; color:#005400">Neumannz</span>''']], [[User talk:Neumannz|''<span style="color:black; font-family:Agency FB Bold">The Dark Falcon</span>'']]</span> 00:58, August 13, 2010 (UTC)
*KH I: ??
*CoM: ??
*Re:CoM: ?? 
*KHII: Neither "grey" nor "gray" is used, in either the script or journal.
*KH Days: ??
*KH BbS: ??
*KH Rec: ??
@@ Line 1: / Line 1: @@
-{{Forumheader|The Realm of Sleep|The World that Never was}}
+{{Forumheader|The World that Never was}}
 <!-- Please put your content under this line.  Be sure to sign your edits with either your talk page template or four tildes ~~~~ -->
@@ Line 69: / Line 69: @@
 {{The Inexistent|text='''Does it bloody matter?  Who said we have to user American English?  Like half the editors here aren't American, so does it matter?'''}}
 {{TNE|time=00:40, August 13, 2010 (UTC)|attntext=Thing about the American spelling is when I first suggested a remodel of the [[Manual of Style]], it did say "The language of the wiki is English", but for consistency's sake, we needed to go with a standard. And most of us (including the BrE-speaking people) actually said that American English is the way to go, considering the gameplay is in American English, even for the British release (the spellings are never modified). Now if this were to happen (and it already has), consider that the in-game spellings hold precedence over whatever other spellings go. It's like how we once called "Identity Disk" the "Identity Dis''c''", but switched it to Disk because it was the in-game spelling.}}
-{{LA|Vtext=Inexistent: It states so in the [[KHWiki:Manual of Style|Manual of Style]].}}
+{{LA|Vtext=Inexistent: It states so in the [[Kingdom Hearts Wiki:Manual of Style|Manual of Style]].}}
 Well, we're definitely not changing any names, whatever we choose. Since neither "grey" nor "gray" appears outside of the two names, (correct me if I'm wrong on that,) it is really up to us which one we use for other cases. And in that case, we should follow the MoS. I say "gray".  --<span style="font-size:10pt">[[User:Neumannz|'''<span style="font-size=12pt; font-family:Gisha; color:#005400">Neumannz</span>''']], [[User talk:Neumannz|''<span style="color:black; font-family:Agency FB Bold">The Dark Falcon</span>'']]</span> 00:58, August 13, 2010 (UTC)
-*KH I: Neither "grey" nor "gray" is used in the script
+*KH I: ??
-*CoM: Neither "grey" nor "gray" is used in the script
+*CoM: ??
 *Re:CoM: ??
 *KHII: Neither "grey" nor "gray" is used, in either the script or journal.
@@ Line 79: / Line 79: @@
 *KH BbS: ??
 *KH Rec: ??
-==Poll?==
-{{HikariKH|kat=Can't we just make a poll and decide?!}}
-{{TNE|time=12:51, August 14, 2010 (UTC)|blahtext=Very well then.}}
-{{Xabryn|text=I just want to know if gray wins will we change things that appear in-game too like the grey area?}}
-{{HikariKH|text=My guess is that OFICIAL names will be kept the same, independent of the result, but other instances will change.}}
-{{LapisScarab|time=08:08, August 22, 2010 (UTC)|skinny=So, it's been over a week and "grey" was the winner of the poll by a wide margin. Is this finally settled, with "grey" as the standard?}}
-{{TNE|time=06:28, August 26, 2010 (UTC)|text=Guess it is. ''Grey'' trumps ''gray'' hands down.}}
-{{LA|Vtext=It's not about "what trumps what", but what is correct. But if the community consensus would rather use improper grammar, I'll go with it.}}
-{{DTN|time=01:56, August 29, 2010 (UTC)|text=...wooooooooooooooooooow. Guys, this is a color. Heck, even a Grammar Nazi like me is finding this debate to be blown way out of proportion. Both LegoAlchemist and LapisScarab are right; both "grey" and "gray" are acceptable spellings of the color. While you could say that "grey" and "gray" are limited only to their specific variants of the English language, I am sure that have overlapped in publications and free writing before. As long as the article harboring the text that contains the word "grey" or "gray" stays consistent with its spelling of the term, I see no problem with allowing them to be interchangeable.
-Now, after reading this, it seems like you guys need a bit of humor.
-Below is the color gray/grey, in a form that realisitically illustrates how important and relevant it actually is.
-http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f306/dented-marble/GreyForReal.png
-Below is how dramatic you are making the color gray/grey.
-http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f306/dented-marble/GRASPLODE.png
-In conclusion, this a very simple and diminutive issue that certainly does not require all of this fuss. So, let's stop arguing about gray/grey, or the Gray/Grey Monster is going to come and explode the wiki. Thank you.}}
-{{Maggosh|flint=Well played, my friend. I'll have to concede; back to playing NES games in an irate manner.
-http://i961.photobucket.com/albums/ae93/maggosh/IrateGamerNES.jpg
-Note the grey/gray color of the cartridges, which should hopefully make this post relevant.
-In all seriousness, guys, go with the spelling that comes within the game, even if it is wrong. The game is always right, much like the price and the customer.}}
-{{TNE|time=03:56, August 29, 2010 (UTC)|happytext=Ahahahahahaha :D You two actually made it so epic, the page actually asploded !
-But yeah, in-game spelling is in-game spelling, I say we go for it. <small>Don't get me started on the rant about someone who said "Who would've ''thunk'' it" when the actual quote was "Who'd have thought it ?"</small>}}
-==Poll==
-<poll>
-Which should it be ? "Grey" or "gray" ?
-In-game spelling takes precedence over everything else. I say "grey".
-American spelling takes precedence over everything else. I say "gray".
-You know what, I really can't decide.
-</poll>